Suppressor Question

[FortTom]

The only weapons I've fired with a suppressor were friends, so maybe 90 to 120 rounds at most, semi-auto. I got turned off from the whole NFA thing with my own personal nightmare that isn't worth the time to go into here. I'd just get pissed of again if I did.

But my question is: What's the life span of a can under average usage. I know "average" is ambiguous and means different things to different folks, but I guess I mean not full auto all the time, and not 20 rounds a year. Just curious about the "return" rate for the stamp, the can, etc.

Just curious, and maybe some non-can owners here also might be too.

FT[:D]

[alamo5000]

I would easily say tens of thousands of rounds. Probably more like 50,000 or could be more than that. It just depends on how much of what and on what barrel length and so forth. Rifle and pistols are different. If you do a lot of mag dumps and all that... it all depends. Heat will most likely kill a can before anything. If you were say using it for hunting applications you could keep it for a lifetime.

There are other failure points too, such as mounts. Those things can lead to baffle strikes and such. As can the excess heat so it just depends. A regular joe shooter I would say somewhere between 30-50 thousand rounds maybe? You will wear out a few barrels before you wear out the can with the caveat of not a lot of crazy full auto meltdowns.

[FortTom]

Up to 50K...hell I know folks that don't shoot that much in a lifetime. That's definitely an eye opener for sure.
FT[:D]

[alamo5000]

Of course there is always the issue of maintenance and so many other factors... in good conditions you might get more than 50 thousand rounds. I just threw out a number out of the blue, but your caveat of 'not 20 rounds a year'...

You should watch Military Arms Channel about suppressors (they have a special episode on them). He runs a mag and then checks the heat... cans will heat up SUPER fast. In one mag you won't be able to touch it and in 3 mags it can damage the longevity of the suppressor (on a rifle). I am talking about back to back fire mag dumping.

It will also depend on the construction of the can you get. Not all of them are made of the same stuff. I would expect my Recce 5 to last me a really long time, especially on a 16" gun.

As far as I am concerned what generally you should make sure of is that the can has a chance to cool enough before running it long and hard. 60-90 rounds on my Recce 5 is about the zone for me on my Recce 5. If I did 90 rounds I would let it cool almost all the way before I did it again. With 90 rounds that can will easily exceed 1500 degrees or more.

[alamo5000]

The little Griffin Optimus Micro... if you ran a can rated for 5.56 on a .22LR forever... that little thing is built like a tank. You could get a LOT of rounds through that thing. I am talking a WHOLE lot.

Pistol cans will be a different story because of booster springs etc that eventually wear out...

There is always the chance that you get a crappy load of ammo and you wind up with a baffle strike too. But barring all that other stuff a good solid mount is for me extremely important. Part of the reason why I went with the Griffin Taper Mount is because there are no moving parts to wear out.

[gatordev]

20K seems to be a realistic number for a high round count gun and one of the more "mainstream" cans (KAC, SF, Gemtech, etc). You can probably get more easily with a lower firing schedule and/or longer barrel like alamo said, assuming nothing breaks free and clobbers the baffles. Then again, it will still work fine, it just won't be as efficient.

[alamo5000]

I have also heard about erosion as well. If you shoot certain ammo or just shoot out of an SBR you will have more erosion than you would out of an 18" gun. Again with modern suppressors the materials they use are lighter and more resistant than older ones so don't take 'conventional wisdom' at face value.

For example the Q Erector is a .22 LR can and the Griffin Optimus Micro is also a .22 can... but the Q is made almost all out of aluminum and it has a lot of moving parts to it. Even with that you could get a lot of life out of the Q but the Griffin would be a lot longer life. By a lot.

There are too many factors here to cover all of them.

[alamo5000]

20K seems to be a realistic number for a high round count gun and one of the more "mainstream" cans (KAC, SF, Gemtech, etc). You can probably get more easily with a lower firing schedule and/or longer barrel like alamo said, assuming nothing breaks free and clobbers the baffles. Then again, it will still work fine, it just won't be as efficient.

Yep. 20,000 to 50,000 is what I have read everywhere.

Then I see videos where they melt the can off the gun with a belt fed machine gun.

It is a soup of what you're after. The construction, the materials, the firing schedule, the heat build up, the barrel length it gets shot on...

If Fort Tom wants to shop for a can this is the place to be at. We can provide our sometimes a lot (or in my case more limited) experience with cans to help make a decent choice.

[ChattanoogaPhil]

As already said... it depends on barrel length, rate of rife and duration.


"Just curious about the "return" rate for the stamp, the can, etc."

Depends on who you buy the can from. Some offer lifetime service/repair for 'normal' use.

Example --- AAC - SILENCER LIFETIME LIMITED WARRANTY AAC will repair or replace free of charge any silencer manufactured by AAC for the duration of this lifetime warranty. This warranty is of unlimited duration, and covers, at Advanced Armament Corp. and its affiliates’ discretion, service, repair, and/or replacement of damaged products caused by normal use.

-----

Friend of mine had a baffle strike with 30cal AAC can. They repaired it no questions asked.

I put about 30k rounds through a Yankee Hill Machine rimfire can. The baffle was toast. Sent it back to YHM. They cleaned it up, put in a new baffle and returned it free of charge.

[Joelski]

Tom, this is what sold me on the Griffin. Skip to 5:40 if you like.


https://youtu.be/HQD1jU7O9Vw

It runs nicely on anything from .22 up to 300 Win Mag. I don't shoot a lot of sustained fire simply to avoid burning the living bejeezus out of my legs when it's slung out of the way. With that kind of regimen and a decent cleaning now and then, it should outlive you. Get it and enjoy!

[Slippers]

It depends on how you use it, more than anything else. Heat is the issue, so full-auto and short barrels reduce suppressor life. There are pictures of KAC cans cut in half that had 75K+ through them. My Saker 762 has over 12k rounds through it and the blast baffle, while eroded heavily, still has a lot of life left.

[fledge]

Ask the manufacturer of the can you are interested in. They may even repair or replace the core, giving your can as much life as the existence of the company they made it. I talked to Dead Air about this and they said they would take care of it. Hence why I primarily use flash hiders and not brakes.

[FortTom]

Wow, thanks to all for the info. Certainly was an eye opener!!

FT[:D]

[Default.mp3]

I have seen NT4s by the bushel with over 50,000 rounds through them that still tick merrily along, though the build-up of carbon and copper 3-D lattice does drop some of the performance.
I have seen NT4s that weigh ounces heavier than new, with the users having no idea how many rounds have gone through them in their decade(+) of service.
I have seen NT4s that have been put on MK46s, and shot so much that when they were cut in half the first two baffles were eroded to the point of near non-existence, and they would still mount.
The SOCOM SOUM for NT4s basically states that if you have an end-cap strike, the armorer is to do an inspection and then file the protruding flap flat, simply to avoid a cut hazard.
I have seen NT4s with baffle strikes that nobody even noticed for thousands of rounds.
I have seen NT4s used to smash out windows, break through fences, and driven into the ocular socket of non-compliant enclosure occupants to elicit the desired level of passivity, with little more wear than some work KG Kote and chunks of skin and hair.
I've seen them shot half full of sea water, until they glowed like a 2-bit rave dancer, and then cooled off in a mud puddle.

It ain't cool anymore. It ain't sexy anymore. But if you're going to give a suppressor to a Marine, nothing less than an NT4 is worthy of their abuse. There are a bunch of good cans out there today, and the NT4 is a bit of a dinosaur, but it's a f***ing T-Rex hombre.
Yeah, I work at KAC. But I was a Jarhead first, and I came here for a reason, and it wasn't for the beach or the pay.

Oh, and make sure you wipe off those chunks before going to Boogytown, the smell is not pleasant.Source: http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?191130-Which-suppressor-would-you-like-the-USMC-to-adopt&p=2417344#post2417344

[Joelski]

Dig the occular socket fornication! That's hardcore rock and fucking roll, boss!

I would post a troop advisory cautioning against the use of lubrication, or smoothie end caps for skull fucking jihadis. [:)]

[voodoo_man]

Most quality can companies have good policies to repair/replace. Get a quality can from a quality company and you won't have to worry about any issues.

[FortTom]

Tom, this is what sold me on the Griffin. Skip to 5:40 if you like.


https://youtu.be/HQD1jU7O9Vw

It runs nicely on anything from .22 up to 300 Win Mag. I don't shoot a lot of sustained fire simply to avoid burning the living bejeezus out of my legs when it's slung out of the way. With that kind of regimen and a decent cleaning now and then, it should outlive you. Get it and enjoy!
Damn, that's freaking red hot. Then shoots 1in. groups after. Almost hard to believe.

[alamo5000]

Damn, that's freaking red hot. Then shoots 1in. groups after. Almost hard to believe.

If you were going to get a suppressor... let's just ask in theory... what is the primary types of guns you would like to run it on and for what reason?

Would it be a pistol or a rifle? Would it be an AR or a bolt action? Would it be for hunting or target shooting, etc etc?

What would your preference be in the way of a suppressed firearm?

[FortTom]

If you were going to get a suppressor... let's just ask in theory... what is the primary types of guns you would like to run it on and for what reason?

Would it be a pistol or a rifle? Would it be an AR or a bolt action? Would it be for hunting or target shooting, etc etc?

What would your preference be in the way of a suppressed firearm?
Alamo, if I did, and I doubt I will, it would be for a LR-10 or AR 15, or both, primarily for target shooting. Probably mostly for range use where I don't blast the guy/gal's next to me with 7.62 with a loud as hell brake hanging off the end.:o

FT

[gatordev]

Alamo, if I did, and I doubt I will, it would be for a LR-10 or AR 15, or both, primarily for target shooting. Probably mostly for range use where I don't blast the guy/gal's next to me with 7.62 with a loud as hell brake hanging off the end.:o

FT

If all you're doing is plinking (and I'm NOT using that word in a derogatory sense) at the range, especially with .30 cal, I just don't see why you wouldn't want a can (barring budget and/or state law limitations). It's just such a more pleasurable experience.

I understand many are opposed to the idea of the NFA, and if that's one's stand, fine. But if that's not the issue (for anyone, not just picking on you, FT), a suppressor is a very "nice to have."

[FortTom]

If all you're doing is plinking (and I'm NOT using that word in a derogatory sense) at the range, especially with .30 cal, I just don't see why you wouldn't want a can (barring budget and/or state law limitations). It's just such a more pleasurable experience.

I understand many are opposed to the idea of the NFA, and if that's one's stand, fine. But if that's not the issue (for anyone, not just picking on you, FT), a suppressor is a very "nice to have."
Gator,
I'm not opposed to the idea of the NFA, it's just that my one and only foray into NFA items was such a pain in the ass, that once I finally got rid of that thing, (SBR), I swore never, ever to screw with it (NFA items) again. I know most people don't mind the process, especially trying to get rid of an item, the costs, the waiting times etc. I say go for it. And the price for 1 or 2 wouldn't break the piggy bank, so no objections there. Another morbid reason is that at nearly 60, I could be sitting on the couch drinking a cup of coffee, and "Pow" my ticker blows. I don't want to leave a safe full of NFA stuff for a family member to figure out what to do with it. I really don't have any close relatives that are "gun people" anymore.


But to your first point, yeah, pretty much "plinking" at paper at the range. If shooting terrorist members were legal, and they sold them as targets at the range, I might expand my horizons as far as the number or rounds fired while plinking.

FT[:D]

[Joelski]

I guess the idea of being "married" to your NFA stuff is supposed to be at least okay, if not appealing (No offense meant!). A can is much more of a useful, lifetime kind of thing. It certainly isn't the game to be in for liquidity of assets, or if you're a flipper. Basically, the mentality you need to have is that the funds for that item no longer exist in an accessible way, however you now possess something a very small minority of gun owners have exactly because of the bother and expense, but also because it signifies your enthusiasm for guns, the same way your NRA Life Member tagline does.

[Former11B]

Gator,
I'm not opposed to the idea of the NFA, it's just that my one and only foray into NFA items was such a pain in the ass, that once I finally got rid of that thing, (SBR), I swore never, ever to screw with it (NFA items) again. I know most people don't mind the process, especially trying to get rid of an item, the costs, the waiting times etc. I say go for it. And the price for 1 or 2 wouldn't break the piggy bank, so no objections there. Another morbid reason is that at nearly 60, I could be sitting on the couch drinking a cup of coffee, and "Pow" my ticker blows. I don't want to leave a safe full of NFA stuff for a family member to figure out what to do with it. I really don't have any close relatives that are "gun people" anymore.


But to your first point, yeah, pretty much "plinking" at paper at the range. If shooting terrorist members were legal, and they sold them as targets at the range, I might expand my horizons as far as the number or rounds fired while plinking.

FT[:D]

If you’ve got your items in trust, they can be sold IN STATE to an 18+ year old in an estate type sale; a class III dealer can help. Individually registered items can be Form 5’d tax free to a beneficiary. Just have a folder with your stamp(s) and instructions along with a dealer to contact in the event of your passing.

[JGifford]

The only weapons I've fired with a suppressor were friends, so maybe 90 to 120 rounds at most, semi-auto. I got turned off from the whole NFA thing with my own personal nightmare that isn't worth the time to go into here. I'd just get pissed of again if I did.

But my question is: What's the life span of a can under average usage. I know "average" is ambiguous and means different things to different folks, but I guess I mean not full auto all the time, and not 20 rounds a year. Just curious about the "return" rate for the stamp, the can, etc.

Just curious, and maybe some non-can owners here also might be too.

FT[:D]

Honestly? Lifetime, or until a baffle-strike gets it. Then, it's back to Surefire for a $650 re-core.

What do I mean by lifetime? Well, on a 10.3" 5.56, it's going to differ from on your 16" 5.56.

My .22, I only have around 1000 rounds through. There is ZERO wear at all. None. Nada. I can only guess...

On my 5.56 cans, I have one with about 5-7k rounds through, 1/4 of that on a 10.5" gun. It has minor sandblasting of the blast-baffle, but it is also a few ounces heavier. Got some gunk in it.

I expect, since I run my 5.56 cans on 14.5" and longer guns, to get about 30K rounds out of them. The .22 can, well, I suspect a baffle strike will end it before any wear even occurs, really.

How common are baffle strikes? Well, I have had a grand total of ONE in the roughly 8500 rounds I have fired suppressed across all my firearms/cans, and it was very very minor. Surefire offered to take the can in and fix it, gratis, and I declined. It's my "beater" can, I use the hell out of it, and neither accuracy nor sound attenuation was affected, so I am motoring on!

Every item I have is on individual stamp. I prefer it.


ETA: All these people whining about being "married" to something that typically cost less than $2K, won't incur costs during its lifetime, is inanimate, will never nag you, etc. and then turning around asking me "So when you gonna get married". Y'all just miserable AF and want company.

[JGifford]

It depends on how you use it, more than anything else. Heat is the issue, so full-auto and short barrels reduce suppressor life. There are pictures of KAC cans cut in half that had 75K+ through them. My Saker 762 has over 12k rounds through it and the blast baffle, while eroded heavily, still has a lot of life left.

...and the guts are are full of crap. If a baffle strike doesn't get you, filling the can up with copper/carbon/copper, will. I have yet to see a QUALITY can that has "been shot out" unless it was something like a hard life on a 7.5" 5.56, and then, see "Baffle strike".

[Slippers]

Just think, the more you erode the baffles, the less backpressure there is. For a lot of older designs, this is a good thing, and in some cases, will result in less noise at the shooters ear! [BD]

[JGifford]

Just think, the more you erode the baffles, the less backpressure there is. For a lot of older designs, this is a good thing, and in some cases, will result in less noise at the shooters ear! [BD]

Awkwardly true!