ATF eForms

[alamo5000]

I just got an email notification from Silencer Shop that says the ATF will be launching eFile in December of 2021. They said it's expected to go live sometime between the 15th and 28th of this month.

One would hope that this makes the filing and approval of suppressors to be on par with that of SBRs.

Anyway posted here for discussion purposes.

Link below to the Silencer Shop blog talking about the new moves.

https://www.silencershop.com/blog/post/eforms-update-atf-eforms-launch-imminent?utm_source=Drip&utm_medium=Email&utm_campaign=12.3.21%20%5BeForms%20%230%5D&utm_content=Body&__s=cd9lr4pcouyggv5mciom

[alamo5000]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_w3TD6Xznso

[alamo5000]

All this being said at present I might get 'one more' suppressor, that being another 9mm can. I have two for each caliber so far except for 9mm.

I don't shoot enough 45 to warrant getting cans for that caliber but nothing is impossible.

Regardless if I get one more or ten more it would be nice to not take a year to get a tax stamp.

[BoilerUp]

One would hope that this makes the filing and approval of suppressors to be on par with that of SBRs.

Is it too much to hope for a much better experience than the e-form process for Form 1? That was certainly built by the lowest bidder. I suspect they just added Form 4 to what they already have. Still, it's worth putting up with the pain of navigating e-forms for the reduction in wait time. I have two cans in jail so will be curious if this can help with those.

[alamo5000]

Is it too much to hope for a much better experience than the e-form process for Form 1? That was certainly built by the lowest bidder. I suspect they just added Form 4 to what they already have. Still, it's worth putting up with the pain of navigating e-forms for the reduction in wait time. I have two cans in jail so will be curious if this can help with those.

According to the link above it won't help with anything already submitted/cashed. It's just new stuff.

[Former11B]

I’m gonna be less than thrilled if these start getting like 3 week approvals and stuff already in the works gets pushed back

[Joelski]

Is it too much to hope for a much better experience than the e-form process for Form 1? That was certainly built by the lowest bidder. I suspect they just added Form 4 to what they already have. Still, it's worth putting up with the pain of navigating e-forms for the reduction in wait time. I have two cans in jail so will be curious if this can help with those.

Took 4 damn tries to get my form 1 done. Sumbitch kept shutting down and taking me back to the splash page.

[Joelski]

According to the link above it won't help with anything already submitted/cashed. It's just new stuff.

But they also warn people not to pull their app and resubmit; that doing so would just lengthen their wait, so hopefully the process is applied evenly according to that instruction.

[mustangfreek]

I got a can i docusigned last week and no movement as far as Shipping, so I’m assuming I’m in line to get mine in the efile line.

[BoilerUp]

According to the link above it won't help with anything already submitted/cashed. It's just new stuff.

Well, I think that's what happened with they came out with e-forms for Form 1. It didn't noticeably delay the processing of paper, but the e-file was a worked as a separate queue. It figures, since SS mailed in my Form 4 the day before this announcement, so I'll probably be sitting for 6-8 months while others will start getting their e-form stamps back in 2.

[gatordev]

The major part of the delay with paper forms is the collection and shipping. The ATF doesn't process a form and then mail it off, and it's been made worse by moving the check/charge processing to a different part of the country. The short version is that the forms you send go to the money collection office. Your forms sit with many others until there's enough to ship a whole tub together. Then the form itself gets processed, and then those forms sit in a tub until it's full and then it gets sent off to be returned. On top off that, the background collection is a process that has the lowest priority, behind whatever other backgrounds are needed by the collecting agency (from what I understand, it's the FBI and not the military investigation agency).

So bottom line, a big wait is the shipping of paperwork x2 (or maybe it's x3...I can't remember). Hopefully eFile Form 4s will be as quick as the other forms. It's sure taken them long enough to come out of beta.

[Uffdaphil]

If they were serious about cutting their work load, they would allow several NFA items on the same form. I won’t hold my breath.

[gatordev]

If they were serious about cutting their work load, they would allow several NFA items on the same form. I won’t hold my breath.

With eFile you're kind of doing that now. You can batch process multiple items and only one background check is completed (or not at all if you fall into the time window).

I just hope eFile is stable enough that it's able to stay up when all the dealers hit it at once submitting items.

[Uffdaphil]

You can do that for suppressors? Will the SS kiosk be considered eFile? I’d love to get two more .30 cals.

[alamo5000]

Will the SS kiosk be considered eFile? I’d love to get two more .30 cals.

The kiosk is not 'e-file'. It was a way to make collecting information about people easier. When they had 41F finally put in place you had to get prints and this and that...and if you had 4 people on your trust that meant each person would have to get fingerprint cards and whatever for each stamp.

With the kiosk they can store one set of prints indefinitely and just print them out as needed. It turned the process into almost a once and done system.

None the less they would still print out your documents and get a physical envelope and mail stuff to the ATF on your behalf. I recall Silencer Shop posting pictures of pallets full of documents waiting to be mailed to the ATF. They literally had to be picked up by forklift.

With e-File all that snail mail goes away. Instead of having to print out everything and stuff envelopes it can be submitted all online.

[Uffdaphil]

Thanks much. So how do you submit fingerprints via eFile?

[alamo5000]

Thanks much. So how do you submit fingerprints via eFile?

With a Form 1 that was the only thing you had to mail in. I am not sure if the new system allows you to submit digital prints or not.

The bulk of your documents including the trust docs, all the rest of your data (and anyone else's that is relevant), payment, etc are all digital.

[BoilerUp]

The kiosk is not 'e-file'. It was a way to make collecting information about people easier. When they had 41F finally put in place you had to get prints and this and that...and if you had 4 people on your trust that meant each person would have to get fingerprint cards and whatever for each stamp.

With the kiosk they can store one set of prints indefinitely and just print them out as needed. It turned the process into almost a once and done system.

None the less they would still print out your documents and get a physical envelope and mail stuff to the ATF on your behalf. I recall Silencer Shop posting pictures of pallets full of documents waiting to be mailed to the ATF. They literally had to be picked up by forklift.

With e-File all that snail mail goes away. Instead of having to print out everything and stuff envelopes it can be submitted all online.

SS had integrated their digital system (kiosk) with ATF e-Forms for Form 4 several years ago but the ATF threw a monkey wrench in things so SS had to shut it down. I had a stamp get caught up in that mess and it took several months to resolve, ultimately requiring me to go into the e-Forms system and do stuff. I believe SS has been working with ATF on integration so I'll be interested to see if they re-enable that. Regarding prints, I believe SS prints out physical print cards from your digital prints and sends in the paper copy. This is essentially what a lot of finger printing services do these day, too....scan your prints and print out the cards.

[Joelski]

I've read that digital prints will be accepted. Not sure how you can get a workable file from the LE agency, or how it'll be handled. I also read that digital prints (and possibly all prints submitted on eforms at some point) will be good for 5 years towards subsequent applications. But that came from the internet, with no source other than "My buddy at So-and-so said", so put that in one hand next to the shit and wish in the other...

Seems there's a lot of internet buddy cred on the line with this one...

[gatordev]

Very few organizations take paper prints anymore, so if the NFA branch is able to interface with the electronic systems, that would be a huge win. When I redid my security clearance last year, I just went to a shipping store that had the system set up and they scanned a bar code and it told it where to go, and DONCAF has been doing that for years.

Lots of other LE and non-LE agencies have been doing electronic prints for years now, as well, so here's hoping this is one more step to make it easier.

[mustangfreek]

Sent SS a email and just heard back, my docusigned/back order filled can that I signed on the 30th is hanging out and will be Efiled they say.

I’ll update what happens, last can was 5 months , so if it beats that I guess it’s cool. No actual stamp but whatever.

[alamo5000]

I just got an email from SS that says the new system is live. In that email it says form 4s are expected to clear within 90 days.

7924

[Joelski]

Already logged in.

[tact]

There’s reports from dealers the site is unstable right now. Apparently everyone including distributors submitting all at once.