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Stickman
2 December 2007, 12:04
I have a guide on Refinishing AR15s with Norrells MolyResin posted at the below link.


Please feel free to post questions, comments, suggestions, or lessons learned here.



NORRELLS AR15 REFINISHING GUIDE (http://www.weaponevolution.com/forum/showthread.php?t=176)







.

Rktman
3 November 2008, 11:13
I have an old Bushmaster lower that is turning that red color. I would like to refinish it, so I'm seaching for the black that would match my Noveske N4 upper the best. Any opinions on which black would match best?

Stickman
3 November 2008, 19:04
The Norrells SOCOM black would be a good match for most of the current receiver finishes. Its a very flat black, but part of that depends on application method.

TriggerTX
18 February 2009, 17:27
Stick, I have a question,
Can I recoat and/or apply different colors of molly once I have baked for an hour.

As you mentioned how you paint the parts, reassemble, paint again, then bake. Can I paint everything again after I bake once? I guess thats what I'm asking.

Thanks,

Malleus Dei
18 February 2009, 18:23
I have a guide on Refinishing AR15s with Norrells MolyResin posted at the below link.

http://www.weaponevolution.com/forum/showthread.php?t=176

Please feel free to post questions, comments, suggestions, or lessons learned here.

What are the chances of getting some additional photos of that awesome FDE shot gun I have seen glimpses of.. Remington?

Nice!

Stickman
18 February 2009, 19:27
Stick, I have a question,
Can I recoat and/or apply different colors of molly once I have baked for an hour.

As you mentioned how you paint the parts, reassemble, paint again, then bake. Can I paint everything again after I bake once? I guess thats what I'm asking.

Thanks,




There are no problems recoating after curing, what you mention should turn out fine. Just make sure you aren't getting any finger oils or anything else on it between coats.

Stickman
18 February 2009, 19:28
What are the chances of getting some additional photos of that awesome FDE shot gun I have seen glimpses of.. Remington?

Nice!

Thats not my shotgun, though it is pretty slick. I'm not sure what the owner coated it with, I believe it was one of the Brownells spray can coatings, but I could be wrong, and I'm not sure which one he might have used. I'll check and post the info if I remember.

TriggerTX
18 February 2009, 19:49
There are no problems recoating after curing, what you mention should turn out fine. Just make sure you aren't getting any finger oils or anything else on it between coats.

Thanks for the helpful info. And thanks for the wright-up. That was a big help.

Josh

Stickman
24 February 2009, 10:04
Thanks for the helpful info. And thanks for the wright-up. That was a big help.

Josh



Glad you liked it. At one point, there was a guide to refinishing 1911s, as well as a guide to refinishing 870s also. They were on a board that went away, and I didn't have copies of the writeups.

Lawdog
1 March 2009, 14:51
How get a Kimber Warrior lower with Kim-Pro finish read to be Sprayed with Norrells Blk? Do I need to BeadBlast the whole 1911A1 lower down to bare steel?

Army Chief
1 March 2009, 22:04
At one point, there was a guide to refinishing 1911s, as well as a guide to refinishing 870s also. They were on a board that went away, and I didn't have copies of the writeups.

Stick,

I realize you've probably already considered this, but just in case you aren't aware of it, did you give The Wayback Machine (http://www.archive.org/web/web.php) a try? Seems like a long shot when we're talking about a defunct forum, but it might be worth a quick recon to confirm that.

AC

Stickman
1 March 2009, 23:50
How get a Kimber Warrior lower with Kim-Pro finish read to be Sprayed with Norrells Blk? Do I need to BeadBlast the whole 1911A1 lower down to bare steel?


I wouldn't bead blast anything, it creates a slick surface, I would sand/ aluminum oxide blast. The Norrells website gives good info on which grades and PSI to use.



AC- I've got to remember where it was, its worth a check.

TriggerTX
10 March 2009, 20:21
Well my first paint job is complete, well until I refinish the scope again. I'm not too happy with the Norrell's air dry paint. It hasn't adhered to my Leupold scope very well at all. This thing was CLEAN. I chose not to blast in the event that the paint adhesion sucked, so at least there would be a black base, well with this airdry I'm back to the black stock finish real quick.

And unless I chose the wrong color, it doesn't match at all to the tan heat dry applied to the rest of the rifle.

Has anyone had better luck with airdry?

Stickman
10 March 2009, 20:31
I have not used the air dry version at all, so I'm not going to be much help. Can you strip it back off, or is it too late for that?

TriggerTX
12 March 2009, 01:49
Yeah, it will come off nooo problem.

Tee-Bruce
17 March 2009, 17:07
Stick,
Any special prep using Norells on blued firearms...will it adhear any differently than on a parked surface?
Thanx in advance!

Stickman
17 March 2009, 23:42
Stick,
Any special prep using Norells on blued firearms...will it adhear any differently than on a parked surface?
Thanx in advance!



Parkerized steel is the best, and its surface soaks it in. Bluing is hard to coat, and giving it a quick sand blasting would certainly yield better results. I want to say that the www.molyresin.com webpage talked a bit about coating over a blued surface.


http://www.molyresin.com/molyresin_tips.asp


Pretreatment: All Metals
The surface of the parts to be coated should be clean and free of any oils, solvents, etc. Best adhesion is a freshly abrasive blaster surface using 60 to 90 grit aluminum oxide at 60 to 80 psi. Best cleaning methods appear to be soap and water; however, a chemical cleaning with MEK, acetone, etc. is also acceptable. The dullest finish for each color is achieved by abrasive blasting before coating. This will give the best coat bonding and adhesion, as well as, uniform texture. Sandblasting removes minor scratches and metal surface imperfections. You may have varied adhesion results over a blued finish as some are too smooth to allow proper adhesion. If you rough up or totally remove the blued finish with sandpaper, you may have acceptable adhesion. Chrome or nickel-plated parts should always be abrasive blasted for best adhesion. After sandblasting, rinse parts off with soap and water to remove sand dust and oil from the air compressor. In regard to air pressure used to abrasive blast the metal, use low pressure of 40 to 50 psi for aluminum and 60 to 80 psi on steel.

Uglyduck
18 March 2009, 08:28
This may be a little off topic but...how durable is a holographic print "dip"? Lakota Ind. (http://www.lakotacorp.com/multicam.aspx)

Tee-Bruce
18 March 2009, 09:51
Thanx Stick!

Stickman
18 March 2009, 10:46
This may be a little off topic but...how durable is a holographic print "dip"? Lakota Ind. (http://www.lakotacorp.com/multicam.aspx)

I am unsure of what they coat the film transfer with, so I'm not sure. It would be interesting to find out.

Lancelot
15 May 2009, 10:24
Here was one of my first attempts. An A1 upper on a Bushmaster lower. I did the upper, not the lower.

http://coloradoshooting.org/v-web/gallery/albums/bbadmin-Album-1/CMT_CAR_021.sized.jpg

Bigger size
http://coloradoshooting.org/v-web/gallery/albums/bbadmin-Album-1/CMT_CAR_021.jpg


I used flat black on this one. I picked up a cheap Testors brand compressor out of the model airplane aisle at Walmart for like $50. I cleaned it with whatever I had around. I put it in the oven to heat it up first. Then I sprayed it. Then I cured it in the oven.

Now my wife hates the smell, and I was almost single again for doing it. Now I do it when its warm out and she's not home. I just leave the kitchen doors and windows open. [:D]

Overall I'm happy with it. I did a CZ52 also just for fun, and a 20" AR barrel that had been turned down from an HBAR to a Govt profile. No pictures of those.

When people see it, they never assume I did the finish myself.

GriffonSec
15 May 2009, 13:02
Looks good. The SGW A1 I just picked up is a candidate for this, and I've been reading up on it most of the morning. I actually found an old thread from 04-05 that had a 1911 Stickman did...

My only thing is prep. While there's nothing terrible on either, there's just a couple of small knicks around both sides of the mag release, and the edges of the magwell. I know they say no media blasting, so I'm guessing maybe high grit emery board? I've got a small air compressor and air brush that I've used form motorcycle parts, looks like I'll be doing refinishing on the guns now too. These threads have talked me into it.

GriffonSec
7 June 2009, 10:54
Ok, Found a neat little tool for abrasive blasting, and easily controlable to avoid the pin hole areas. Tha Paasche Air Eraser kit.

http://www.jerrysartarama.com/discount-art-supplies/Airbrushing/Paasche-Airbrushes-and-Sets/Paasche-Air-Eraser-Kit-and-Accessories.htm

I figured since I had an airbrush compressor this would work out perfect. It comes with a 1/4 in connector, so I found that it works best off a standard air compressor. Between 30 and 45 lbs of pressure it roughs the finish without removal, and 60-80 will takes it off with focused effort. I had several high spots I wanted to pay special attention to, and some homegrown texturing that needed to be smoothed. I also wanted to have the logo and lettering show a bit better after refinishing so I did some pointed areas there also. Overall, a handy tool, and if you have small projects aside from weapons refinishing (this will come in handy on the sporty) a worthwhile investment.

My SGW lower, ready to go to Orion for SBR marking -

http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt323/griffonsec/blast.jpg

Stickman
28 June 2009, 14:26
On a anodized surface, there is no need to abrasive blast. If there was a teflon finish applied over the top, it might be a different story.

Thomas M-4
26 August 2009, 14:57
Stickman will Norrells Moly work good on a bolt carrier would it reduce friction any?

kanaka
25 September 2009, 00:12
Very informitive post Mr.Stick! Thanks!
Now if I ever get nit-picky about an upper & lower that don't have similar finishes, I know there is an easy affordable fix even a barney like me can rock.

Stickman
25 September 2009, 23:31
Stickman will Norrells Moly work good on a bolt carrier would it reduce friction any?



I've done it, and it doesn't seem to make a big difference, if any.

Thomas M-4
3 October 2009, 21:06
Gotcha thanks one last thing does it seem to wear normal.

Stickman
7 October 2009, 13:08
Norrells wears very well, or I would not have bothered doing the writeup. [:D]

geewiz
1 November 2009, 13:02
Hi

I have a sdi 16" ss barrel that was suppose to have a duracoat finish on it that I paid some one to add on when I had this rifle built. Well the stuff is just falling off and I really doubt its duracoat. I would like to refinish this barrel. Does norrel or cerakote work with stainless steal? Since purchasing this rifle I've learned much more about ar's to where I'm pretty good about rebuilding them but I don't have refinishing experince. I was looking at doing it myself since I have airbrushs and the tools but the supplies and time I don't have. So any recommendations on who I could trust to have this done right would be great.

Oh I almost had someone bead blast it for me so thanks for posting the info on bead blasting slickness

Thanks

Stickman
8 November 2009, 13:14
If you abrasive/ sand blasted the barrel, Norrells would adhere without any problem.

GriffonSec
22 January 2010, 11:22
It's been a bit, but I finally got around to refinishing both the SGW A-1, and my Para P-13 with Norrell's.

Before:

http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt323/griffonsec/sgw-car.jpg

After:

http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt323/griffonsec/dads-guns-008.gif

My carry gun, ParaOrdnance P-13:

http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt323/griffonsec/dads-guns-016.gif

http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt323/griffonsec/dads-guns-034.gif

http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt323/griffonsec/dads-guns-035.gif

http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt323/griffonsec/dads-guns-004.jpg

I used two different spray guns between the AR and the .45. The one for the AR was more of a detail gun, which laid it fairly thin. Switched to the Badger Hobby gun, much more flow and threw me off a bit, hence the few foil marks in the finish around the mag release button.

Overall, I love the Norrell's.

ColdDeadHands
6 February 2010, 18:46
so how is the finish of the project AR holding up Stick?

Stickman
6 February 2010, 22:23
Its not getting anywhere near the abuse it should be to be honest.

However, the duty carbine that I refinished 5 years ago has held up fantastic, and that was a weapon that I beat the dog snot out of. It has been handed over to a friend/ squad member, and he now carries it as his duty weapon.

ColdDeadHands
6 February 2010, 23:40
Good deal. Can you recommend a good product to coat a SS barrel w/o backing it?

Stickman
7 February 2010, 00:21
Good deal. Can you recommend a good product to coat a SS barrel w/o backing it?


I'm not sure what you mean by backing.

With the SS barrels that I've seen, they all need to be sand blasted. There are very cheap ways to coat a barrel. Norrells or KG Gunkote is a very thin thermal cure product which is fantastic. If you want to go cheap, you can pick up header spray paint from any autoparts store, just make sure you go with the very high heat versions (1200 duplicolor in black), and that is functional also.

d90king
7 February 2010, 06:01
Stick all I can say is thank you! This place is like a brain trust. Your tutorial just solved a problem I was concerned with on a HBAR project. I was thinking I would need to send the Colt lower out to get refinished so it would match a LT 13.2 rail and DD big hole upper. Thanks again!

Now, I just have to get past destroying a like new Pre Ban no sear block Colt A2 HBAR.[bash] As a Colt guy it kills me to do, but I really want a flat top HBAR that I will shoot instead of just looking at it in the safe looking all pretty.

Am I an idiot for considering this?

ColdDeadHands
7 February 2010, 06:45
lol I meant baking. You answered my question tho, thanks.


I'm not sure what you mean by backing.

With the SS barrels that I've seen, they all need to be sand blasted. There are very cheap ways to coat a barrel. Norrells or KG Gunkote is a very thin thermal cure product which is fantastic. If you want to go cheap, you can pick up header spray paint from any autoparts store, just make sure you go with the very high heat versions (1200 duplicolor in black), and that is functional also.

chase102798
18 February 2010, 09:47
Although not mentioned much here, I use Duracoat exclusively since there is no baking. For a one time job they offer kits that will get a small job like a barrel done no problem. I use Duraheat (resists 1800 degrees) on any parts I expect high temp like carbine barrels and gas blocks. Duraheat doesn't get mixed like duracoat, so it's even faster to use. Just air dry and assemble in 24 hours. The HK black duraheat (not duracoat) is the best match I have seen to make a barrel match a Vortex Flash hider. A PWS 556 is slightly more gray in color than the HK duraheat. I had two daniel defense gas blocks that rusted up and I almost couldn't get the screws off when I wanted to change the barrel. So I sand blast them too now and use the duraheat. I, personally, have had excellent results with these products for what its worth.

TripleBravo
18 February 2010, 10:07
I’m partial to Duracoat as well. No matter what you use, I think the key to a good refinishing job is the prep work. If it’s a ferrous metal, I always degrease, then sand blast with Aluminum Oxide, then parkerize, then I apply the Duracoat. Any other metal gets everything but the parkerizing -- Same thing with polymer materials. Scopes, however, don’t get the blast. Those I rough up the surface with a Scotchbrite pad.

I've posted this pic in other forums, but here are a couple of weapons I Duracoated: (yes, the flash hider is mounted upside down)

http://i718.photobucket.com/albums/ww189/wjt1169/m4g1901.jpg

TripleBravo
18 February 2010, 10:21
Not to hijack the thread, but I came across some older project photographs that you may find interesting. A guy came to me with a really banged up AR. It's previous user had etched his name in the forward assist housing. He wanted the whole thing fixed and refinished.

Here’s the upper receiver (disassembled) the way it came to me:
http://i718.photobucket.com/albums/ww189/wjt1169/damagedupper01.jpg

I preped the upper as mentioned in my previous post, then I used Durafil (made by the manufacturers of Duracoat) to fill in the etched area. This is applied by airbrush or HVLP (airbrush in this instance) in coats, then sanded smooth. Here’s a picture of the Durafil applied:
http://i718.photobucket.com/albums/ww189/wjt1169/uppersanded.jpg

Then I Duracoated the upper:
http://i718.photobucket.com/albums/ww189/wjt1169/uppercoated.jpg

This is the finished product:
http://i718.photobucket.com/albums/ww189/wjt1169/completeM4FDE02.jpg
(Sorry...these photos are not up to my normal standard, but good enough to be informative.)

oregonshooter
12 September 2010, 19:31
On a anodized surface, there is no need to abrasive blast. If there was a teflon finish applied over the top, it might be a different story.

For Cerakote a light blasting of 100grit Alum-ox is preferred. You don't want to hog the ano off, just texture it for better adhesion. I would think this true of any ceramic application... surface prep is the key.

GriffonSec
18 January 2011, 15:15
Digging up the dead here......

Re-refinished the SGW A1. I love the simplicity with the Norrell's. I let it heat up more than other projects to get it a bit flatter for the "theme build".

Grey-Black moly resin for my XM177e2 Clone/RestoMod. Should have the barrel back from ADCO Monday or Tuesday.

http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt323/griffonsec/atbuildup.jpg

http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt323/griffonsec/a1mag.jpg

Stickman
28 February 2011, 20:49
Looks good, the preheating really makes a difference and helps keep it a very flat color.

GriffonSec
25 July 2011, 20:31
New project finished for a friend (the one I had trigger issues with). 14.5" pinned BABC 6.8 middy, Norell's gray/black moly resin on rail, upper/lower recievers, A5 extension tube. Again, preheated the parts to about 225, cured, then final coat after the parts cooled to about 250 then a recure (2 cured coats):

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i106/pdogkilr/Firearms/Geoff-s%20Six-Eight/IMG_1756cropped.jpg

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i106/pdogkilr/Firearms/Geoff-s%20Six-Eight/IMG_1754cropped.jpg

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i106/pdogkilr/Firearms/Geoff-s%20Six-Eight/IMG_1759cropped.jpg

Aragorn
26 July 2011, 16:09
That's really slick looking. That grey is beautiful.

neo9710
29 July 2011, 06:03
That's really slick looking. That grey is beautiful.


Agree..nice job!

Stickman
29 July 2011, 14:34
The color looks great, nice job!

GriffonSec
30 July 2011, 16:53
Many thanks, I'm really glad he was pleased with the outcome as well.

Stickman
31 July 2011, 14:32
I think a lot of people miss the preheat concept when they do refinishing. It can make a huge difference.

GriffonSec
31 July 2011, 15:46
Agreed. Aside from prep/cleaning after several experiments, preheating is the most important part not only for final finish, but seems to lay a bit more even while working with it. I use the heat gun on high only between each light coat to help maintain close to the preheat temp. I run the final, second cured coat with the upper and lower together, to ensure the finish matches as close as possible. For some reason, it seems the uppers try to turn a green/gray, much like the old park'd color when shooting the grey/black. Not really noticeable in pictures, but under flourescents it is.

Gator
28 July 2012, 20:50
Stick, any experience with Cerakote's micro slick on a lower? 5pins did a couple of A2s with dry film lubricant, as did Markm on an upper, but dont know which type they used nor how they've held up so far. Interested to know how this coating goes on and holds up. I plan on coating a BCG with this stuff and figured I'd use the rest to refinish an old lower.

Stickman
29 July 2012, 11:13
Stick, any experience with Cerakote's micro slick on a lower?


No, no use of it at all.

oregonshooter
29 July 2012, 16:53
The heat cured version of Micro-Slick works better than the air cure IME.

I coated one BCG in each on my carbines and the Heat Cure seems tougher, not showing as much wear on the rails.

I would not use it in place of H-series cerakote on a lower though. It's 1/10th the thickness of Cerakote and will wear faster.

cerakote has some lubricity of its own and seems good enough to me. Whatever VLTOR has in their uppers is the slickest stuff I've seen and makes for a smoother action than either NIC product IMO.

-Jim (certified Cerakote Applicator)

Gator
29 July 2012, 21:40
Thanks! I really appreciate it.

harleytech
12 August 2012, 06:07
MolyResin is the best...!
I use it all the time I refinish...[:D]

Stickman
2 October 2012, 19:06
Quick shot of FDE on some stuff....

http://stickman.rainierarms.com/galleries/Magpul%207/STCK3183-A-1500-Stick.jpg

groundnpound
9 January 2013, 11:37
This may be a little off topic but...how durable is a holographic print "dip"? Lakota Ind. (http://www.lakotacorp.com/multicam.aspx)

Personal experience has shown that it stays around and SOLID for at least 5 to 7 years depending on usage. I have used it for a number of things around the house. It is EASY to apply - just apply it to something else first to get the hang of it.

I actually applied some to my son's rims instead of spending another grand on new ones and he gets more attention from the perceived "One Offs" that I think he would from new rims.

Just one word of caution - once you start - everything you see will look like it needs to be "dipped"!

Check out this vid for a better idea:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlI9M_Rc_vQ"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlI9M_Rc_vQ

Thermal
7 February 2013, 07:56
I've used Moly resin once before and it turned out great. In regards to the thermal curing, does anyone have experience with coating Magpul products and curing them at a lower temp for a longer duration? I see one of the post here mention plastics but doesn't specifically talk about Magpul products.

Stickman
7 February 2013, 16:46
Yes, I've done it. The problem is that the metal components which are often in the polymers take the heat different, which can often bring about damage.

Gator
27 August 2013, 17:45
What's a good filler to use with norrells? Can durafil take heat?

Computalotapus
3 November 2013, 11:46
Doing color fill for lettering that is etched into the weapon..is it basically apply color let dry and wipe off excess with mineral spirits and reapply if you pull it out of the lettering or is there a super secret squirrel trick to it?

Raylocker
3 November 2014, 01:10
The Norrells SOCOM black would be a good match for most of the current receiver finishes. Its a very flat black, but part of that depends on application method.