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Specialized Armament
7 June 2010, 16:42
Lets talk about 5.56 NATO. Where did the idea that it is a chamber come from and why has the error gone unchallenged for so long?

If it is a chamber;

Why is the US the only NATO country using it and who can I call at NATO to get a copy of the chamber print?

Contrary to what you have heard on another forum, 5.56 NATO isn't a chamber.

Just like 9mm NATO and 7.62mm NATO, 5.56 NATO is a caliber designation.

Comments?

rob_s
7 June 2010, 17:12
The terminology that I've always heard and tried to use is "chambered for the 5.56", although I'm sure I sometimes slip up and say "5.56 chamber" as a kind of shorthand. In fact, the Chart says "5.56 chamber".

5pins
7 June 2010, 20:40
Are you saying that there is no difference between the .223 and the 5.56?

Specialized Armament
7 June 2010, 20:48
Are you saying that there is no difference between the .223 and the 5.56?

Not at all. I am saying there is no such animal as a 5.56 NATO chamber.

70Karmin
8 June 2010, 07:54
Ok, im confused here. So what do we call the chambered AR's that are designed to use the 5.56 mil. spec ammo?

Eric
8 June 2010, 10:45
From ATK (http://le.atk.com/pdf/223VS556.pdf).



The Difference Between 223 Rem and 5.56 Military Cartridges
There is a general misperception by the shooting public that the 223 Rem and 5.56 Military cartridges are identical – just different designations for commercial and military – and can routinely be interchanged. The fact however is that, although somewhat similar, they are not the same.

The cartridge casings of each have basically the same length and exterior dimensions.

Mil Spec 5.56 ammo typically has higher velocity and chamber pressure than the 223 Rem.

The 5.56 cartridge case may have a thicker sidewall and a thicker head - to better withstand the stresses generated by the higher chamber pressures. This, however, reduces the powder capacity of the case - which is of concern to the reloader.

The 5.56mm and 223 Rem. chambers are similar but not identical. The difference is in the “Leade”. Leade is defined as a portion of the barrel directly in front of the chamber where the rifling has been conically removed to allow room for the seated bullet. This portion of the chamber is more commonly known as the throat. Leade in a 223 Rem. chamber is usually .085”. In a 5.56mm chamber the leade is typically .162”, or almost twice as much as in the 223 Rem. chamber.

You can fire 223 Rem. cartridges in 5.56mm chambers with this longer leade, but you will generally have a slight loss in accuracy and velocity – compared to firing the 223 round in the chamber with the shorter leade it was designed for.

Problems may occur when firing the higher pressure 5.56mm cartridge in a 223 chamber with its much shorter leade. It is generally known that shortening the leade can dramatically increase chamber pressure. In some cases, this higher pressure could result in primer pocket gas leaks, blown cartridge case heads, and gun functioning issues.

The 5.56mm military cartridge fired in a 223 Rem. chamber is considered by SAAMI (Small Arms and Ammunition Manufacturers Institute) to be an unsafe ammunition combination and is listed in the “Unsafe Arms and Ammunition Combinations” Section of the SAAMI Technical Correspondent’s Handbook. It clearly states; “In firearms chambered for 223 Rem – do not use 5.56 Military cartridges.” Federal Cartridge is a member of SAAMI and supports this position.

Federal’s XM193 packaging currently has a warning that states “For use in standard 5.56 Chambers. Do not use in non-standard 5.56 chambers.” This warning is also listed on the XM193 Product Specification Sheet. Winchester also has a similar warning on their USA brand 5.56 ammunition packaging: “Use only in firearms in good condition designed and chambered by firearm manufacturer specifically for this 5.56 ammunition and so marked on the firearm.”

It is our understanding that commercially available AR15’s and M16’s – although some are stamped 5.56Rem on the receiver – are manufactured with .223 chambers. Our advice however should be that it is the customer’s responsibility to know what their firearm is chambered for and choose their ammo accordingly.

Skintop911
8 June 2010, 11:09
The terminology that I've always heard and tried to use is "chambered for the 5.56", although I'm sure I sometimes slip up and say "5.56 chamber" as a kind of shorthand. In fact, the Chart says "5.56 chamber".

I'm guilty of the same shorthand.

What's the recommended terminology and descriptor to use, to identify a chamber capable of safe use of 5.56mm NATO cartridges? And to clearly distinguish it from others.

jmart
8 June 2010, 12:22
Not at all. I am saying there is no such animal as a 5.56 NATO chamber.

Then why the different reamers?

rob_s
8 June 2010, 12:37
Then why the different reamers?

from above

The 5.56mm and 223 Rem. chambers are similar but not identical. The difference is in the “Leade”. Leade is defined as a portion of the barrel directly in front of the chamber where the rifling has been conically removed to allow room for the seated bullet. This portion of the chamber is more commonly known as the throat. Leade in a 223 Rem. chamber is usually .085”. In a 5.56mm chamber the leade is typically .162”, or almost twice as much as in the 223 Rem. chamber.

TehLlama
8 June 2010, 14:43
The 5.56, .223 Wylde, and .223 are distinct chamber dimensions, that vary in how well they perform when fed 5.56 NATO spec pressure loads.

jmart
8 June 2010, 16:19
from above

It was a rhetorical question.

There's a a similar thread on arfcom and the dimensions posted are different than what you listed, but the leade/throat ratio was about the same between the the .223 SAAMI and NATO chambers posted, with the NATO being much more generous. Other meaningful deltas incude a looser throat and a shallower leade on the NATO chamber compared to tehe SAAMI. I've also seen a chart that Randall compiled years ago of various reamer dimensions, from match chambers to NATO chambers, that data was supplied by the various reamer manufacturers. That's posted on ar15barrels.com.