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AR-10
24 July 2010, 13:27
I was just curious, how many of you actually train with .22LR? I'm talking trainer pistols, or AR-15 rifles/uppers/conversions.

I have a Ruger 22/45 that I love to shoot, I bought it because the controls are just like my 1911 and you can't beat the ammo cost.

I figure I already own one .22 so I might as well add to the collection - I have my eye on a Browning Buck Mark at my local dealer.

I am also interested in either a dedicated upper or a conversion for my AR-15 so if you have experience with any uppers or kits please share your thoughts.

Optimus Prime
24 July 2010, 13:37
I just burned up 300+ rounds in my M&P15-22 earlier today in prep for weapons qual next weekend, and I'm about 90% certain my next purchase will be a GSG-1911.

As long as you pay attention to the similarities, and more importantly, the differences between the trainer and your full caliber gun, I think it can be quite beneficial.

AR-10
24 July 2010, 13:44
I was just looking at those GSG-1911 pistols, I never knew about them until about ten minutes ago.

So you are happy with the M&P?

Optimus Prime
24 July 2010, 15:18
More than happy I'd say. I know it's heresy, but the thing's by far more reliable than my 10/22.

Here's my current .22lr setups:
http://a.imageshack.us/img443/9236/22combo.jpg

The P22 is fun, but none of the controls match any of my carry guns, so...

Paulo_Santos
24 July 2010, 16:32
The only problem I've had with using .22 AR's or .22 type pistols is the recoil difference. it wasn't as bad with an AR, but the difference in pistols was drastic. I prefer to handload for my duty handgun and for my AR and train with that.

YMMV.

Optimus Prime
24 July 2010, 19:49
The recoil difference is the downside of any sub-caliber training.

However it's a fantastic way to cut down on flinch, and to hone your trigger squeeze, breathing, and sight picture. I also think it can help significantly with target transitions if you place the targets far enough apart.

AR-10
24 July 2010, 21:40
That is a nice looking setup! Looks like it's a great trainer and fun to plink with.

I think a dedicated upper would be better for me though, I've been looking at some of Spike's uppers but I don't know anyone who has owned one so I don't know much about them.

Also, I found this conversion for the 1911:

http://www.marvelprecision.com/unit1.php

Looks like a well-designed kit, I'm going to do some more research on it and if I end up buying one I will post some pics here.

TehLlama
26 July 2010, 18:26
I run the gamut from airsoft training analogs to CMMG and Kimber .22 conversions. The recoil difference is much more significant in pistols in regard to shot to shot conditioning, but for presentation and first round on the move drills, they don't give up much at all.
Running airsoft gas blowbacks has really tempered my expectations with training copies, but focusing training with analogues on drills that play to the strengths and similarities of these can make them very worthwhile.
The added value of being able to use them purely recreationally makes up the startup price more palatable for me.

stormwalker
31 August 2010, 21:21
my only gripe with the .22 conversions in the AR platform is they are not nearly as reliable as my full house 5.56 guns. with the .22 conversions I'm forever digging out a spent shell stuck in the charging handle, or extracting a dud .22 round, or clearing a stove pipe, etc.

oh, I wouldn't mid so much if the clearing drill was similar to clearing a 5.56 malfunction, but the stroke on the .22 conversion and the very nature of how to clear a .22 malfunction from the weapon is completely different to me.

so training with a .22 conversion leaves me a bit underwhelmed.

I keep the .22 conversion as a survival kit piece for hunting small game when I'm out in the sticks hiking or off roading. it's good enough for that.

Optimus Prime
31 August 2010, 22:02
I've never had a case get under the charging handle on the M&P15-22, the charging handle is actually nearly half the length of a standard AR's, so it's pretty much impossible. Downside is the charging stroke is only half the distance, but 99% of the time it'll still extract a dud round.

I still think the S&W is the best way to go for a .22lr AR trainer though.