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ZH-330
17 October 2010, 05:18
Hi WEVO! My name is Zach. I would first like to say what an awesome resource this forum is. I have learned a ton just reading a few of the stickies and other welcome posts. A little background on myself, I have been around guns my entire life. Mostly handguns and hunting rifles. Over the past few years I have gotten away from hunting and have become interested in the tactical/ technical side of firearms. I am currently looking to start assembling my first AR, most likely during the cold Ohio winter months. I have a few simple requirements, a whole bunch of ideas and need some help putting it all together so I can start spending money!

** This will primarily be a range/ tactical class weapon and also serve as a back-up SD weapon**

- Functionality/ Durability take priority
- Simple in design and execution (not into all the flair and fancy add-ons)
- Start with BIUS with the ability to add on a newer optic system (I learned on an M16 with iron sights... stick to what works!)
- * Preference- As light as possible

As I said, I have many ideas and an end point in mind, just not sure how to get there. I have been looking at a BCM 16'' middy lightweight upper and the Spikes Tactical LE M4 lightweight upper. I like the "pencil" design, as I do not believe for my purposes the MIL profile is needed. I have been keeping my eyes on the magpul MOE furniture because I feel it has a greta blend of affordability, toughness and adaptability. Unless anyone has any other thoughts or suggestions? For the rear sight I wasn's sure if I could go with an MBUS or similar folding rear sight and still retain the ability to add optics later on?

I apologize for the long post. I wanted to give as much info as possible. Any other thoughts/ suggestions are greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance!

Quib
17 October 2010, 06:47
Welcome to Weapon Evolution Zach.

TehLlama
17 October 2010, 16:50
Welcome!

You're already well ahead of the curve for a first post, and you're looking in the right places.

Short list:

Colt 6720 - Light, simple, and if the carbine length gas and handguards work, no need to look further.
Daniel Defense V5 - Midlengthgas, extended rail, pencil barrel, included iron sights
Spike's LE Middy - Midlength FSB, best price hands down.

Then there's making a BCM or DD upper with DD Lite or TROY/VTAC Extreme rail. All are practical options.


If you want to stick with MOE and simplicity, get the Spike's LE middy model, MOE furniture all around, maybe splurge a bit on the rear BUIS (LMT or KAC Micro for adjustability, TROY, DD, or MBUS for simplicity)
The KAC Micro rear sight may seem pricey, but works great under optics, and is a great stand-alone iron sight, and more than covered by the savings if you go with a BCM, DD, or Spike's upper.

ZH-330
17 October 2010, 17:17
TL,
Thanks for the ideas. I would love to go with DD or Noveske parts, just not sure if I can justify spending the money, at this point and time. I am using this "build" as my intro into the AR arena and am already planning a second, much higher end/ high speed build for later. I will definitely take a look at the KAC rear sight.

Stickman
17 October 2010, 21:32
Zach,

Are you planning on assembling everything, or just the lower?

ZH-330
18 October 2010, 03:50
Stickman,
Im not sure at this point to be honest. I dont know enough about assembling the upper to know if I could do it on my own with my limited amount of experience and access to the proper tools. I will assemble as much as I can and am definitely assembling the entire lower.

Eric
18 October 2010, 06:53
Stickman,
Im not sure at this point to be honest. I dont know enough about assembling the upper to know if I could do it on my own with my limited amount of experience and access to the proper tools. I will assemble as much as I can and am definitely assembling the entire lower.

If you don't have the tools to assemble an upper, buy an assembled complete upper. Tool purchase will drive the cost way over what the cost of an assembled one would be.

Paulo_Santos
18 October 2010, 07:07
Welcome aboard. You have a good plan. If you don't have too much experience with putting AR's together, I'd recommend getting an assembled AR first if it is for serious use.

ZH-330
18 October 2010, 09:08
Not so much on the serious use. I am of the opinion, and please correct me if I am wrong, but I should be able to assemble the lower quite easily. I may just buy the completed upper with the hand guards I want and put it on the built lower. One other question I have though. What are the nice (read: within specs, well machined, reasonable price) lowers that would work well with a BCM upper? I dont want a huge gap between the receivers or have a hard time getting them to play nice.

Stickman
18 October 2010, 09:35
Not so much on the serious use. I am of the opinion, and please correct me if I am wrong, but I should be able to assemble the lower quite easily. I may just buy the completed upper with the hand guards I want and put it on the built lower. One other question I have though. What are the nice (read: within specs, well machined, reasonable price) lowers that would work well with a BCM upper? I dont want a huge gap between the receivers or have a hard time getting them to play nice.

Almost every lower will fit fine, if you want a color match, BCM uppers have a bit of a satin finish to them. Some lowers have a very flat/ matte finish.

ZH-330
18 October 2010, 09:59
Good to know! Thanks Stick

TehLlama
19 October 2010, 17:25
Most forged lowers work just fine (not many sources for originals, but a plethora of rollmarks). Blemished ones from BCM, Noveske, and others can be quite cheap and have pretty minuscule cosmetic problems.
BCM, MEGA, CMMG, DPMS, and Spike's have a dark sheen that seems to play well with each other. Stripped Mega, CMMG, and Spike's units can be found quite affordably.

FAR more important is the LPK - much better if everything is in spec. WhiteOakArmament, G&R, DanielDefense are great options (the first two can be had without triggers to save if you're using aftermarket ones). The included LMT, BCM, DD, and Colt units are great as well.
An in-spec action spring, mil-spec buffer tube, and good buffer (ST-2 is the heaviest I'd recommend for a middy).

That said, as far as practical value, it's extremely hard to beat a BCM Complete Blemished lower, with a Spike's M4LE Upper. No assembly required, most places that carry the BCM will be able to swap in MagPul furniture too.

ZH-330
19 October 2010, 18:07
I reread my OP and the comments made thus far, along with speaking to some mil/ le friends. I am questioning my plan for a basic build starting out to only turn around and spend double that on the build that I actually want. Some are of the opinion that i should shoot with the basics first and then buy/ build a second ar. The other side of the coin would be to build a higher end, open ar platform that I could add to later on as skill and funds increase. I put together a parts list and would like your opinions. I have always been a do it right the first time guy, which is why I am kind of fighting myself on this ar build.

BCM BFH 16’’ Mid Length w/ VLTOR VIS 12’’
BCM BCG
BCM Gunfighter CH Mod 4
BCM forged lower w/ Magpul MIAD and Magpul CTR
Magpul MBUS front and rear flip up sights

I figured I could get away with waiting on the sling and the optics until I get the gun assembled and at least throw some lead down range. Any guidance is greatly appreciated!

skd_tactical
20 October 2010, 08:57
Welcome to the Forum.
There is a ton of great info here in this post alone. I built my first "civvie" AR only to quickly realize what I liked and disliked about my issue M4. The fact that I went with a system that works great, but was not as configurable as I would have liked down the road caused me to want to build another. One huge change I went with on my second, third and fourth builds..... they are like Tattoos, just one isn't enough, is front and rear flip up sights, not getting a 14.5 inch barrel that required me to pin the flash suppressor and just keeping the weapon as modular as possible so I could update and change it in the future. You can't always get the exact weapon of your dreams off the bat, but to be able to shoot now and get the dream attachments later is great way to do it. One thing I would suggest is trying out the different configurations your friends have. This will help you make the best solution, also don't just shoot that weapon, carry it, climb a ladder with it, run with it. You may find out that you don't like this sling for this or that, or the larger (or smaller) charging handle doesn't work because it gets caught on something..... Luckily most AR's are pretty modular so you can change things down the road. Enjoy the fun and the headache of finding out what works best for you.

SOS

TehLlama
20 October 2010, 15:11
Based on the pricing of your most recent stuff, a BCM EAG Package would be within reach, and worth considering.

ZH-330
20 October 2010, 15:21
I am ultimately trying to get the most for my money. I dont mind spending more for the ability to add/ rearrange my gear in anyway I see fit. I like simple and yet I don't feel that a "basic" ar 15 will meet my needs down the road. Unlike most, I am trying to resist building more than one as the price and my own needs dictate my gun purchases. Thanks to all of you who have voiced your opinion and/ or given me some other options to look at. I am hoping to start piecing this build together soon. Stay tuned!