Back at it again

[DM1975]

So I was at a gun show this last weekend and bought a Trot TRX Extreme 11" tube and now I have to build a rifle around it... [:D]

I think I may go for a recce style rifle. My version of a KISS rifle. I figure that this may be my do it all rifle that I can use for home defense, coyote hunting, and all around runnin' and gunnin'. I am now retired so working on a budget, but I still want to use quality parts. I really want a 1-4X type scope with a BDC in it and am thinking of a Leatherwood and attaching a Burris fastfire II on an offset mount. CMMG seems to be what I am leaning towards on the upper with one of their 16" med contour barrels, and while I am not a big Magpul user, I am thinking about using one of their AFG's on it and not the usual KAC g money grips I have used for so long. What is everyones thoughts?

[AR-10]

I dunno, but post pics when it's done.

I just saw your deer/coyote gun, very nice.

A Recce-style build is on my list, I'll get to it someday.

[Quib]

DM...good to see you over here at Weapon Evolution!

[m24shooter]

DM it is good to see you here.
As far as your optics go, have you thought about the Burris XTR 1-4? It would do what you're thinking about using two optics for, plus give you the illuminated reticle.
http://swfa.com/Burris-1-4x24-Xtreme-Tactical-XTR-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P45510.aspx
It may help you out on the money side of things by using one optic for both, and it has a BDC. I had one for a while and it was a nice little scope. I ended up trading it for another optic but I would not have had any problems keeping it. For the money they are nice scopes.
If you shoot (or want to shoot) thumb over bore, or just want more of a smooth transition when using the VFG as more of a hand stop than hand grip, the AFG is nice.

[Keebsley]

You could always go with a BMC Midlength upper group with BCG and charging handle for $520. I wasn't sure which CMMG 16" Med contour you were looking at but definitely cheaper from what I could gather if working off of a budget.

[DM1975]

Thanks guys, I have been off of all of the forums here for a while now. I have been looking at the Burris as well but didn't know for sure if I wanted to use it or the Leatherwood. If you liked the Burris then that is good enough for me, I will look to add it to the build pile. I am up in the air about the AFG. I have always used the g money grips, but have been wanting to try something new. I guess it wouldn't hurt to get it and try it out and see if I like it or not. I am getting ttired of lugging that heavy tan rifle of mine around and the lack of lit reticles makes it harder for me when the sun starts to go down.

[DM1975]

You could always go with a BMC Midlength upper group with BCG and charging handle for $520. I wasn't sure which CMMG 16" Med contour you were looking at but definitely cheaper from what I could gather if working off of a budget.

I have thought about bravo company and think that I may go with them instead. I wonder if they can install a micro gas block on it for me or if I would need to cut down the front sight to fit under the handguards?

[Paulo_Santos]

I've tried a lot of different 1x4 scopes and also the micro red dot with a scope and never liked the setup because it was a compromise scope. The 1x4 scopes are not as fast as the red dots on 1x and I found myself mainly using it on 4x, so I just ditched them for a TA33 and an EOTech.. The new AFG is better than the first one, but it is not for everyone. The only way to know if you will like it is to try it. At least they are affordable.

[Hatter]

My compromise for the scope/red dot problem was the Leupold CQ/T Mark 4. The only down sides to this are the price and the weight compared to other scopes and dots. I found mine online for about 700.00. It affords you the ability to run true 1x with an etched reticle. You can then dial in the brightness to illuminate the reticle in red and dial up the power to 3x. Runs on a single AA battery and when mounted to the ARMS throw mount gives absolute repeatability without re-zeroing which I can attest to.

[DM1975]

Optimally I would put a TA31F on top of it, but not only have I medically retired since my hiatus ffrom the gun world, but I have also added a third bambino to the fire team. I can not afford to buy another ACOG at this time, but maybe later on when I get a few things out of my way I can replace the optics with an ACOG.

[DM1975]

My compromise for the scope/red dot problem was the Leupold CQ/T Mark 4. The only down sides to this are the price and the weight compared to other scopes and dots. I found mine online for about 700.00. It affords you the ability to run true 1x with an etched reticle. You can then dial in the brightness to illuminate the reticle in red and dial up the power to 3x. Runs on a single AA battery and when mounted to the ARMS throw mount gives absolute repeatability without re-zeroing which I can attest to.

While I am a huge Leupold fan, I just can not see myself getting a CQT. It lacks the BDC that I want for one thing. On top of that, and not to sound superficial, but it is butt ugly.

[Paulo_Santos]

Optimally I would put a TA31F on top of it, but not only have I medically retired since my hiatus ffrom the gun world, but I have also added a third bambino to the fire team. I can not afford to buy another ACOG at this time, but maybe later on when I get a few things out of my way I can replace the optics with an ACOG.

LOL. I hear you on that. Number two will be popping out in a couple of weeks so I know the feeling. I went with the TA33 instead of the TA31 because the TA33 is $800 brand new.

[DM1975]

Hmmmm.... That TA33 looks interesting...

[Keebsley]

A few people say that the best gas block is a cut down FSP. :) And not that hard to do. Just have to have a few tools and voilah! Don't have to spend more money on a gas block.

[DM1975]

A few people say that the best gas block is a cut down FSP. :) And not that hard to do. Just have to have a few tools and voilah! Don't have to spend more money on a gas block.

Oh yes, I am quite inventive with cutting tools [:D]

[TehLlama]

Maybe go low profile, get the Centurion lightweight 16", and run that setup with the TA33? That thing would be a tack driving feather.

[DM1975]

Interesting idea. I am not sure I know much about Centurion barrels. I was going to go with a medium contour to cut down on the weight but maintain accuracy out to 5-600 yards. Would their barrels be able to maintain that accuracy?

[Paulo_Santos]

They make some of the best barrels out there. With good ammo or good handloads, the Centurion barrels will hold their own.

[DM1975]

Would their lightweight barrel be good for a precision application or would their recce barrel be the one to get? I wouldn't mind cutting the weight down as much as possible, but I need to keep at least a 1 MOA barrel at 600 yards.

[Paulo_Santos]

Their recce barrel would be best for the best possible accuracy, but I'd call him up and see what he suggests. 1MOA is possible with the Hammer Forged barrels.

[DM1975]

Thanks, when I get the cash together I will give them a call. I like what they have to say about their recce barrels, and I like what I hear about the hammer forged barrels.

[AR-10]

It's good to see you around again, I really like that tan rifle of yours.

A long time ago you told me who made that handguard and I forgot...

[DM1975]

Thanks. The one on the tan rifle is a Badger Ordnance

[AR-10]

Thanks, I could not remember who it was.

I just happened to see that rifle again yesterday in a thread over on ARFCOM before I saw your thread here.

I also just looked at the 10.5" you posted in the "Explain your layout" thread, how big is the flash out of that birdcage with that short little barrel?

[DM1975]

I have never really noticed it. I am sure it is considerable, but not enough to effect me. It is damn loud though.

[DM1975]

OK, so I think I may change this build up a bit. I am now thinking of doing a 12.5" build instead. [BD]

[DM1975]

OK, going with 16" for sure, lol. I can't make my damn mind up. Will get the new Burris TAC30 1-4 as well.

[AR-10]

Haha, you're almost as bad as me.

I say almost because you're actually thinking yours through instead of changing stuff after you build it like I usually do.

I'm about to send my M4 upper to ADCO to hack up my FSB.

Stupid pinned Vortex.

[DM1975]

Lol. I have flipped this design around in my mind over and over again. I want it to be as practical and as universal as I can make it. I have gone back and forth about putting bipods on it and am still undecided on that. Wanting it to be a recce style rifle. I have a Surefire M951 to use on it but I think I want to go lighter, like a scout light, but still need it to be IR capable and not $400.00

[AR-10]

Well, I wish I would have done more research before buying all of the parts for my current setup.

I will never again pin a muzzle device to a barrel, in fact I won't be buying anything with a barrel shorter than 16" from now on and not just because of the NFA or pinned flash hider b.s. - I am also concerned with the loss of velocity when you start going shorter than 16".

You should look around on ebay, I got my Scout there NIB for $220 shipped.

[DM1975]

Well, I wish I would have done more research before buying all of the parts for my current setup.

I will never again pin a muzzle device to a barrel, in fact I won't be buying anything with a barrel shorter than 16" from now on and not just because of the NFA or pinned flash hider b.s. - I am also concerned with the loss of velocity when you start going shorter than 16".

You should look around on ebay, I got my Scout there NIB for $220 shipped.

Don't be afraid of the NFA thing, I have a 10.5" LMT AR15 that I use hog hunting and it is great and not as much a PITA to get as it sounds. It is one of my favorite rifles.

[HS2]

So I was at a gun show this last weekend and bought a Trot TRX Extreme 11" tube and now I have to build a rifle around it... [:D]

I think I may go for a recce style rifle. My version of a KISS rifle. I figure that this may be my do it all rifle that I can use for home defense, coyote hunting, and all around runnin' and gunnin'. I am now retired so working on a budget, but I still want to use quality parts. I really want a 1-4X type scope with a BDC in it and am thinking of a Leatherwood and attaching a Burris fastfire II on an offset mount. CMMG seems to be what I am leaning towards on the upper with one of their 16" med contour barrels, and while I am not a big Magpul user, I am thinking about using one of their AFG's on it and not the usual KAC g money grips I have used for so long. What is everyones thoughts?

I just finished a build with the Troy 11" and a Sabre fkluted barrel.

http://i726.photobucket.com/albums/ww262/HS2/IMG_1203b.jpg

http://i726.photobucket.com/albums/ww262/HS2/IMG_1205b.jpg

[DM1975]

I just finished a build with the Troy 11" and a Sabre fkluted barrel.

http://i726.photobucket.com/albums/ww262/HS2/IMG_1203b.jpg

http://i726.photobucket.com/albums/ww262/HS2/IMG_1205b.jpg

Very nice, I like that a lot. What is your thoughts on it? Pros? Cons?

[HS2]

Very nice, I like that a lot. What is your thoughts on it? Pros? Cons?

Well, I ive in the frozen north, so it may be a fe weeks before I get out and shoot it. The barrel looks great... if it shoots half as good as it looks the n I'll be happy.


Overall, it weighs about 1 lb less than my Noveske barrelled middy. If it shoots well, then it will become my go-to gun. I'll post a range report when I get it out.

[DM1975]

Well, I ive in the frozen north, so it may be a fe weeks before I get out and shoot it. The barrel looks great... if it shoots half as good as it looks the n I'll be happy.


Overall, it weighs about 1 lb less than my Noveske barrelled middy. If it shoots well, then it will become my go-to gun. I'll post a range report when I get it out.

I bet you wont be dissapointed. It sure is sharp looking.

[DM1975]

OK, I now have my float tube, an AFG (thanks Paulosantos), and an SPR grip (thanks Phoebus). I have an extra Matech BUIS as well, and an M951 weaponslight, which I may change out to some sort of scout light. It would need to be IR capable either way though. I am really leaning towards a Ranier Arms select barrel for this rifle as it has a great price and seems to be made well.

Now, I need to decide on a flash hider. I am thinking Smith Vortec but should I be looking at anything else? Primary job would be as a flash hider, and not a comp.

For buttstocks I can either go with a magpul MOE or just use one of my extra M4 buttstocks until I can afford an LMT SOPMOD or VLTOR. I am not big on many of the Magpul buttstocks, but I really like the MOE.

The scope will be the new Burris 1-4X but may get changed to an ACOG later on as funds permit.

Anything that I am missing or should change around?

[Phoebus]

Hey DM, thanks for the recommendation on joining here:) Good to see Quib and the rest!

Glad I could send you the SPR grip. I just picked up one of those Burris 1-4x scopes and it arrives today, so I'll let you know how it works out.

I just picked up one of the 11" TRX Extreme for my wife's new Appleseed gun. She really loves the width and the weight. I think it will do really well on your rifle. My Recce build is older and has one of the Troy MRF-RX gen 1 rails on it...heavy as hell, wish they had the TRX Extremes when I built it!

Looking forward to seeing the final pics!

[DM1975]

Hey DM, thanks for the recommendation on joining here:) Good to see Quib and the rest!

Glad I could send you the SPR grip. I just picked up one of those Burris 1-4x scopes and it arrives today, so I'll let you know how it works out.

I just picked up one of the 11" TRX Extreme for my wife's new Appleseed gun. She really loves the width and the weight. I think it will do really well on your rifle. My Recce build is older and has one of the Troy MRF-RX gen 1 rails on it...heavy as hell, wish they had the TRX Extremes when I built it!

Looking forward to seeing the final pics!

Hey thanks Phoebus. I will be doing mock up photos as I go. I really like the TRX as well, but getting out on the range will be the test for it. I like that it has rails, but not so much rail space that you gotta cover it all up with something.

I am still up in the air about using bipods too.

[AR-10]

The Vortex is great at flash suppression but the open end design makes it prone to snagging things.

I'm swapping mine out for a Phantom 5C1.

http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/3720/flashhiders.jpg

[DM1975]

Thanks AR-10 I think I will go with the 5C1 then

[Paulo_Santos]

Holy Phoebus sighting!!!! Haven't seen you post in years. How the hell have you been?

[Quib]

Hey DM, thanks for the recommendation on joining here:) Good to see Quib and the rest!


Again, glad to have you on-board!

[DM1975]

Pulling the trigger on the ranier arms barrel today. Wife is letting me get an extra Christmas present so a barrel it is.

[DM1975]

Well after arguing with my bank all day I finally got my account back up and running. I use a very military friendly bank for most everything but it is hard to deposits money to them since they are not local and my local account had sit at zero balance so long that they locked it and didn't tell my wife when she went to deposit my Christmas money into the account. Long story short I finally got my barrel ordered from Rainier Arms. Wonderful people. I hope it shoots as well as it sounds like it should. I will need to get a gas block from them later but will do that when I order my flash hider. I am glad I got that barrel bought and out of the way.

[Quib]

Good deal! Look forward to seeing the completed build!

[AR-10]

You gonna have Rainier Arms Gun-Kote the barrel or leave it naked?

I'm still debating whether I should have them do mine or not.

[DM1975]

I got the Nitride finish. I am planning on putting a nice thick Krylon cammo job on it all anyways.

[AR-10]

Nice, can't wait to see that.

I read somewhere that Nitride can make a stainless barrel last twice as long, don't know if that's ever been tested or not.

[DM1975]

I don't know squat about the nitride stuff other than it was the only one they had in stock [BD] I am glad to hear it was a good choice though. This is gonna be a working/training gun so it is gonna have to work well, last long, take a beating, and accept a decent Krylon paint job. I don't carry a rifle for work anymore, but I am sure you know what I mean. [:)]

[DM1975]

So now what about bipods? I was thinking something low profile like the Accu-Pod Atlis or something that folds up the length of the rail like the Vltor. Was going to just stick th Harris but they are too bulky for what I am wanting. I want it sleek and not a lot of crap to hang up and snag.

Also I may go with a Vltor flash hider to facilitate the use of a Gemtec silencer later on.

[Phoebus]

Holy Phoebus sighting!!!! Haven't seen you post in years. How the hell have you been?

I'm good, better than I have been in a long time, hence my return to wasting my time on the web and spending my money on black rifles ;)

On-topic wise, I received the Burris 1-4x from Midway and mounted in an LT-104 on my 18" WOA barreled upper. I'm pretty happy with it so far. Seems plenty sturdy, zeroed quickly, and it works well enough as a "true 1x" with both eyes open, although there is the typical magnified effect at very close ranges. The illumination is also bright enough for some daylight use, although nothing like a CompM or EOTech.

I'd like it better if the reticule was first focal plane, but I'm quite satisfied for $300. If it's the way you decide to go DM, I think you'll be happy.

[AR-10]

Re: bipod

I ordered an Atlas for my .308, it's a big hit to take but look at the thing.

[DM1975]

Well my barrel arrived yesterday. Wonderful looking barrel and super fast shipping. I was kinda dissapointed to find a few sections of the threads flattened out, other than that it looks great. What is the reasoning behind just three rifling grooves?

Now, unless I just run across a great deal my next buys will be a gas block and an upper receiver.

[DM1975]

OK, here is my progress so far. I started out with this...

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c29/DM1975/Recce/1.jpg

And now I am here...

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c29/DM1975/Recce/2.jpg

I will update as parts arrive.

[Quib]

I like how you have the weapon outlined. Interesting way to visualize the progress.

[HS2]

I just finished a do-it-all build and I really like the Troy rail. It's very light, easy to assemble and it comes with its own barrel wrench.

I went with an EoTech that I already had, but I'm thinking about a Trijicon.

http://i726.photobucket.com/albums/ww262/HS2/IMG_1203b.jpg

[Atticus_1354]

I am doing a similar build with a 13" VTAC rail and an 18" sabre barrel. I am liking the builds in this thread.

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5041/5339451707_02172b9654_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/26720814@N06/5339451707/)
Mock Up Small (http://www.flickr.com/photos/26720814@N06/5339451707/) by atticus_1354 (http://www.flickr.com/people/26720814@N06/), on Flickr

[DM1975]

Ok, so I am back. Been out of it for a while since I started going to school again but I have a rifle that is almost complete. I am just waiting on the optics to arrive and I will be done. I will get update photos up soon. I have painted it camouflage with poo brown accents. I think it looks nice but others may judge differently. I used an LMT lower for the build and have just a regular M4 stock on it now. I will change it to a SOPMOD soon though.

[DM1975]

OK, pics backup, but they are still crappy cell pics

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c29/DM1975/Recce/c17d1d08-2.jpg

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c29/DM1975/Recce/3a87f237-2.jpg

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c29/DM1975/Recce/63df59aa-2.jpg

[DM1975]

Better Picture

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c29/DM1975/Recce/IMG_3239.jpg

[TripleBravo]

Better Picture

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c29/DM1975/Recce/IMG_3239.jpg

Just a suggestion...but you might think about hitting the whole thing with a matte clear coat. That is, unless you like the sheen you've got there.

[DM1975]

It is already hit with a flat clear coat. I ran a filter on it in photoshop to accent all of the parts of the rifle. Makes it look shiny.

Plus I shot it under a monolight with a 48" umbrella so it has quite a bit of good even lighting hitting it.

[TripleBravo]

It is already hit with a flat clear coat. I ran a filter on it in photoshop to accent all of the parts of the rifle. Makes it look shiny.

Plus I shot it under a monolight with a 48" umbrella so it has quite a bit of good even lighting hitting it.

Copy that!

[DM1975]

Change of plans. It is now finished and in new colors...

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c29/DM1975/Recce/IMG_3288-Edit.jpg

[Eric]

Nice! Looks like you lucked out finding the RA SS 1-8 Nitride barrel. I was hoping to grab one, but they are not currently available.

[DM1975]

Yeah, I bought it several months (well over 6) back and think I got the last one. My buddy ordered one the next week and he just got it in a month ago. They are well worth the wait.

[Hatter]

I could really go for one of the Select barrels in 18" midlength. I'm still debating on this competition rifle and the .223 Wylde chamber of my SBR can be tight at times, although its accurate as hell. I'm waiting for the UM barrels to be back in stock.

[TehLlama]

I really like the newer color scheme, that final rifle looks excellent

[DM1975]

Thanks

[tac40]

Impressive build

[Paulo_Santos]

That looks great.

[TripleBravo]

I also like the new camo scheme.

Your Photoshop skills give it a really cool look too...almost like it's a drawing.

[DM1975]

Thanks guys, it is becoming one of my favorites pretty fast. I just need to save up for one of those new civilian legal IR lasers so I can take it hog hunting with me next trip to Texas.

[DM1975]

More pics

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c29/DM1975/Recce/IMG_3360.jpg

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c29/DM1975/Recce/IMG_3336.jpg

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c29/DM1975/Recce/IMG_3346.jpg