Colorado Governor John Hickenlooper talks gun legislation

[MoxyDave]

Colorado Governor John Hickenlooper is now saying "the time is right" for state lawmakers to consider gun control measures. In particular, he talks about the recent theater shooting in Denver with regard to high-capacity AR-15 magazines, saying things like this:

"When you look at what happened in Aurora, a great deal of that damage was from the large magazine on the AR-15 (rifle). I think we need to have that discussion and say, 'Where is this appropriate?'"

Read more HERE (http://www.gazette.com/articles/laws-148475-says-talk.html)

What these people fail to realize is that reloads can be extremely fast. A few hours of training and a fairly skilled person can reload in AR-15 in just a couple of seconds. Can't use a 30-round mag? Big deal, bring a bunch of 10-rounders. The difference IMHO is not that great. Magazine capacity restrictions will not prevent killers from killing. Just my $.02 ...

[Pork Chop]

didn't his 100rd mag jam in the aurora shooting? making the use of said magazine irrelevant?

[FortTom]

Read the first line "the time is right".....please don't tell me given the re-elected campaigner-in-chief, your suprised? Not trying to be negative here, but I'm suprised it's taken this long. I don't think we need gun registration, I think we need to register people that voted for the annointed one, and owns guns...

FT

[WARMACHINE15]

I was proud about his statements that gun laws would not have prevented the theater shooting. Now he waffles. Typical Democrat behavior.

[MikeDawg]

New to the area, but doesn't Denver (proper, not suburbs) have magazine capacity laws?

Sent from my Nexus S 4G using Tapatalk 2

[thatdamngoat]

Gun control should not be portrayed by any Pro 2A person as a Democrat vs. Republican issue. It should be construed as the civil rights issue that it is. Anything else is counterproductive to our cause.

[WARMACHINE15]

In most (not all by any means) instances it is a Democrat vs Republican (political) issue. But that was not my point any way.

[thatdamngoat]

It only continues to be such in political terms because the populace allows it to be divided that way. You don't win any friends by demonizing them because they disagree with you politically. I am, and have always been, both a Democrat AND Pro-Second amendment. I can tell you from knowing Democrats that are anti-gunners that making a sweeping loaded statements like "typical Democrat behavior," or "I think we need to register people that voted for the anointed one" to people will make them automatically turn off instead of even beginning to listen to your well reasoned arguments for why gun control doesn't work. Perhaps to advance our cause we should be inclusive, instead of as derisive as those that don't see things our way.

[FortTom]

It only continues to be such in political terms because the populace allows it to be divided that way. You don't win any friends by demonizing them because they disagree with you politically. I am, and have always been, both a Democrat AND Pro-Second amendment. I can tell you from knowing Democrats that are anti-gunners that making a sweeping loaded statements like "typical Democrat behavior," or "I think we need to register people that voted for the anointed one" to people will make them automatically turn off instead of even beginning to listen to your well reasoned arguments for why gun control doesn't work. Perhaps to advance our cause we should be inclusive, instead of as derisive as those that don't see things our way.
Sorry Goat, but the facts are the facts. The DNC has and probably always will be the vessel for anti-gun legislation. I'm not a Republican either. I'm an independent. But I know who the party of "gun grabber's" are. Facts are facts. Yes there are exceptions, like yourself, but the DNC has adopted, and proudly wears the badge of gun control advocates. And I'll repeat without regret or embarassment, that the "annointed one" is not your friend, and has yet to show his real face, now that he doesn't have to campaign again, of how he really feels about your 2A rights. Hell, he rarely even acknowledges the Constitution, as having authority over his agenda's. He has a rubber stamp Senate, flush full of anti-gun advocates.

So, in short, Goat, I respect your right to declare your allegience to any party you choose, but you can't deny that your choice of party is THE party of the anti-gun advocacy, like it or not.

Respectfully,
FT

[WARMACHINE15]

"Demonizing"...a little sensitive or just grandstanding? I'll connect the dots for you though, I was referring to post election flip flopping as "Typical Democrat". Nothing to do with 2A. I liked the man until this.

Seems to be the only one wound up about someone disagreeing with politics is you.

I'm also independent.

[thatdamngoat]

FT, I never did deny it. Nor was I debating politics, War. What I was pointing out was that if you are want to reach people that may be swayed to our point of view that using statements that sound as if they indict the listener from the start, they very often shut out what you are saying even if it has merit. By the way, I only mentioned that I was a Democrat to point out that I DO know people that could be persuaded but simply write someone off as just another "unreasonable right wing gun nut" rather than someone that bases their beliefs off of facts and reason. Is that right of those people to do? No. Does it happen? Absolutely.

[Paulo_Santos]

Well, the more incidents like the school shooting in CT pop up, the more ammunition the liberals have to use. They are already talking about gun control on TV.

We even had a near massacre where I work on Thanksgiving. The only reason it didn't happen was because my co-workers caught the guy.

It is the nut jobs like this that are ruining it for us.

[MoxyDave]

With the Connecticut massacre today this topic is going to be forefront in the media and politics again. I suspect we are on the verge of another high-capacity magazine ban.

My point with this post was not to devolve into an argument, it was simply to discuss whether or not an average person could be quickly trained to effectively reload a weapon. This might render the high-cap argument moot (at least for those who would listen).

I understand that the media and legislators are not interested in this sort of discussion, I am merely curious what you people think - specifically those of you who operate guns for a living.

[Paulo_Santos]

We all know that a weapons ban won't solve anything. People will get their hands on guns period. The gunman was from NJ where there already is a weapons ban and that didn't stop him.

I wish there was a better way to screen these nut jobs and keep them from legally buying guns, but I don't know how that is possible. We've discussed this at work many times and the only way we can think of to stop these kind of school shootings is to have someone at every school. This could be an armed retired officer or even train some of the school staff and arm them. I have an 8 and a 2 year old and this kind of stuff is scary.

[UWone77]

For those that are directly tied into the industry and use it to put food on the table... do you guys fear that an possible ban will kill the industry and your businesses/jobs? We've been hearing the rhetoric for almost a decade since the last one sunset. I fear it may be closer than we think this time.

[Paulo_Santos]

For those that are directly tied into the industry and use it to put food on the table... do you guys fear that an possible ban will kill the industry and your businesses/jobs? We've been hearing the rhetoric for almost a decade since the last one sunset. I fear it may be closer than we think this time.

If the ban is like what we have in NJ, I don't think much will change.

[Jack Kardic]

I'm a fan of the Israeli method of preventing school shootings. They implemented a policy of arming their teachers back in the 70's and school shootings there have dropped to nearly zero. Rocket attacks are a different matter, but we don't currently have that problem here in the US.

[Paulo_Santos]

Can you elaborate? I don't choose where I PCS, but I've been blessed thus far to stay in (relatively) free states. I'd like to know what gun owners deal with in your shoes.

I've lived in NJ for most of my life. We always had a gun ban here. Other than not being able to own a few things that most states allow, I can still buy the majority of the things here. Sure it sucks only having 15 round mags and having to have a permanently attached muzzle brake and a fixed stock, but you get used to it and learn to adapt and overcome. On my personal AR, I actually have an EMod stock that I just had pinned to the length I wanted and have a permanently attached FSC556, which is probably what I would have anyway. It sucks not being able to have an SBR and a sound suppressor, but honestly isn't a big deal anymore. As long as I can still go out and shoot, that's all it matters.

So if a gun ban comes, it won't affect the gun businesses. Most will just adapt to the new laws and start selling approved/legal items.

I forgot: I also can't have a bayonette lug. Darn. I always wanted one of those. They look so cool. LOL.

[UWone77]

Paulo, I get what you're saying, but I don't want to *adapt* and deal with neutered guns in the future. After my LEO days are over, I'd like to move to a free state so I can have my own SBR's, MG's, and keep my suppressors.

[Paulo_Santos]

Paulo, I get what you're saying, but I don't want to *adapt* and deal with neutered guns in the future. After my LEO days are over, I'd like to move to a free state so I can have my own SBR's, MG's, and keep my suppressors.

I agree with you, but it just isn't a big deal to me.

[UWone77]

Fair enough, like you said... as long as you keep getting to put lead down range, that's the most important thing.

[Paulo_Santos]

Here's my AR:
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f376/paulosantos/picb.jpg

LOL. Just kidding.
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f376/paulosantos/100_7092.jpg

It has everything I need to protect myself.

[UWone77]

If you gotta go piston... you might as well get an LMT MRP Piston upper [BD]

[Paulo_Santos]

If you gotta go piston... you might as well get an LMT MRP Piston upper [BD]

LOL. I wouldn't trade it for anything. It actually has a T-1 on it right now.

[UWone77]

My only question is... where are your other rifles? :D

[Paulo_Santos]

My only question is... where are your other rifles? :D

I used to have a bunch of 6.8's, but I got rid of them and got out of the 6.8 game.

[tac40]

One prespective to think about is the current gun laws in California, this may be the new NORMAL for the rest of the nation. We ALL cared what happened that tragic day in Newtown and every event where innocent lives are taken away by BAD CRAZY people. Unfortunately, mainstream news media thinks otherwise. With the current push, yes it will put prices, products and production to it's limit.

[InstaGator]

Current laws are not enforced effectively. Laws only control the law abiding and punish violators. Criminals, by definition, pay no attention to laws. Therefore a criminal act can not be stopped by laws. Police only respond after the fact. Can the Gov legislate morals, ethics?

If you are offended by anything in this post, blame it on auto-correct & TapaTalk.

[FortTom]

Well, today is the day....want to bring up the demonizing again? Who's doing it..I'll give you three guesses, democrats, democrats, and the President. Want to have an opposing view, and you're not with the left-wing liberal press, no problem, the President has taken care of that for you by accusing any media that offers an opposing view, as "ginning up" and fear mongering. This is a President that desperately needs an issue, and tragically he found a doozy to exploit, the slain children, then all children. Remember 9/11? A reporter took a photo og G.W. Bush, on AF-1, returning from Texas after getting the news. The liberal media tore him to pieces as using the "photo-op" as exploiting 9/11 for his benefit. Turned out that the photo was taken by a liberal media stooge.

Obama surrounds his self with children. Why? Who can deny children?
Gun Control has convienently been redefined as "Gun Violence Prevention". Who could deny that? Nobody advocates Gun Violence? Right?

Meanwhile all of the issues that have plagued him, are worse and getting even more worse. More unemployment, more debt, more unemployed having to dip into their retirement accounts, a freakin President who can't walk and chew gum at the same time, but he's a master of dividing Americans.

What about an armed guard at your childrens school? Why you stupid rube, you think your childrens lives are as important as his? (Sarcasm absolutely deliberate) - in fact he's already got his media fanboy's spreading that one around. Really, how dare we expect our children to recieve the security of even one armed guard per school, vs. the 24/7 protection by highly trained and skilled secret service personnel, that his children receive. Damn us commoner's, are we that arrogant as to think our "regular" children's lives are equal to his kids?

Yeah, bring up your "demonizing democrat" drivel again. I think he made everyone's case and his agenda perfectly clear today. And the only folks who were demonized were anyone outside the DNC zombies that put a total failure of a POTUS in office, for another 4 years of continued total failure.

And the worst of worst, surrounding himself with children, during his speech, demonizing opposing views in the media (totally inappropriate and a cowardly swipe, but it does give the "children" something else to think about besides why Daddy doesn't go to work any more, why Mommy has to make Macaroni and Cheese.....again, purchased with a card that get's her free food, because daddy doesn't go to work anymore. Yes a perfect way to turn americans attention away from his continued failure. Make the whole world worry about "Gun Violence" prevention. That'll warm their empty stomachs at night.

FT

[MoxyDave]

I'm listening to a gun debate on Democracy Now right now. The gun-ban proponents seem to truly believe that banning AR-15s and the like will help prevent future tragedies and lower violence across the board. I am trying my hardest to keep an open mind and listen to both sides of the debate, but it's clear that particularly on this issue, facts really don't matter. Most people I've spoken to have a very strong opinion on the subject either way, and no amount of fact-based reasoning can sway their opinion. My friends who live in urban centers, who have zero experience with or understanding of firearms all have a hard time comprehending why one might need or want an AR-15. My hope is that we can explain to these folks that violence happens in the real world and you can't legislate crazy out of existence. I have a lot more to say on the issue but I'll save that to try and convince my friends to write their representatives instead.

[FortTom]

..... My friends who live in urban centers, who have zero experience with or understanding of firearms all have a hard time comprehending why one might need or want an AR-15. My hope is that we can explain to these folks that violence happens in the real world and you can't legislate crazy out of existence. I have a lot more to say on the issue but I'll save that to try and convince my friends to write their representatives instead.
MD, I've pondered this a lot. I know that there are many people who support the 2A and don't own a firearm. Some are afraid of them, some just don't want one, etc..So while they support the 2A, they are being bombarded by marxist media propoganda, and they too wonder why a person needs a 30 round magazine. They really, due to their lack of interest in owning a firearm, just don't realize that with a couple of day's practice, a determined psychopath can load 10 rd. mags nearly and get off just about as many rounds as they can with a 30 round magazine.

And while they did support the 2A, they see 20 dead children, and the leftist media propaganda machine making political hay out of it, and start having second thoughts on firearm ownership. And, I don't doubt for one second that that Obama's butt monkey's are going to take advantage of that to the maximum benefit (to them) possible.

FT

[Rodman24]

FT - To your point on mags: A couple that my GF has known for a long time, have made a few 'uninformed' comments about 30rd mags over the last week or so.

I haven't known them for long, and I don't really jive with their personalities. So I've tried to walk a fine line, be respectful and not say too much. I know the guy owns a .38 S&W, but they're not gun people.

This evening they stopped by. The gal made another "nobody needs those big magazines" comment. I have no idea how the conversation began, but her comment was made as I came in from the other room. I calmly asked "Would you like me to show you how quickly mags can be changed?" She responded with "You mean you have an assault rifle?!". I just repeated my question. They wanted to see it, so I showed them. Not fast, just smooth. Her response was: "Are you kidding me?" His response was: "Really. That's it?" Later, when the gals were talking about something else, he said "I guess we sounded like dumb asses". I just told him "Lots of people make bad assumptions".

I didn't get all "constitutional" with them. I had a long day at work and just didn't want them in my house that long.

One small victory.

[MoxyDave]

I didn't get all "constitutional" with them. I had a long day at work and just didn't want them in my house that long.

One small victory.

Bravo Rodman. Educating those ignorant with firearms is super important, and it's great that you did it without attacking their beliefs.

[InstaGator]

Rodman24 I wish there was a "like" button I could push on your post. Calm steady education...perfect.

If you are offended by anything in this post, blame it on auto-correct & TapaTalk.