Let the Gouging Begin

[FortTom]

Now that the price gouging is starting (glad I have a LOT of mags), I started looking around at places like ARMSLIST and such.
Guy from my home town has a S&W P-15 for sale on ARMSLIST for $3,000 FIRM. Too bad Dicks sporting goods still has a shelf full of them for $850 or so. Seeing magpul mags with asking prices up to $100 bucks each. One guy actually sold me 6 Colt marked 30 rd mags for $20 bucks each (said he wasn't interested in raping anyone, he sold his AR months ago and just wanted to get rid of the mags).

Well, the politicians have the scalpers utilizing the supply and demand mechanism, before the alert's even sounded. Anyone want to guess how far it'll go? A S&W AR for 5K? 10K? 100 buck a box .223 ammo, (you should have stocked up on reloading supplies)[crazy] even the non-firing extra's, say a vertical forearm grip for 200?......

Just curious, has the annointed one put the scare into your hometown yet? What's your prediction? How far will it go?

FT[BD]

[UWone77]

On a local board I was shocked to see someone asking 6k for a LaRue PredatAR... until I saw a $4200 DPMS package and a 6K RRA package.

If you saw this coming and stocked up the last 4+ years, you shouldn't be worrying about overpaying for anything and spending more time and energy fighting for your rights.

[Rodman24]

Hopefully the folks who are freaking out will soon run out of money. Then the supply/prices will normalize in a few months. Hopefully.

[FortTom]

Hopefully the folks who are freaking out will soon run out of money. Then the supply/prices will normalize in a few months. Hopefully.

That was sort of what I was thinking. I've seen this all before. But I'm good....so I'll spend my money elsewhere...

[csmith]

Hopefully the folks who are freaking out will soon run out of money. Then the supply/prices will normalize in a few months. Hopefully.

Let them spend. This is:
1.) Good for the economy (atleast my local economy. Gun stores are out of every gun that doesn't have a wooden stock).
2.) Good for the gun related companies (think about how much money Magpul is pulling down right now).
3.) Good for us, the intelligent consumers who aren't freaking out. Think about the massive resale market in about 3-4 months if no ban comes. I bet you'll see Noveske's going for Bushmaster prices because the purchaser has no clue what he/she owns, just knows it was bought out of fear and they have no use for it.

That market won't be as tolerant to these foolish games as this one is.

[csmith]

On another note, this "price gouging" term everyone has been using simply isn't accurate. Price gouging is when local stores inflate prices of bottled water and canned goods when a natural disaster has taken place, not when idiots are willingly paying 300% markups to other idiots for goods you don't need to sustain life, such as polymer magazines and lower parts kits. This is panic buying, and the free (-ish) market has simply responded.

[M. Gale]

Price gouging is an economic fiction. High prices serve to discourage people with only a minor need for a product from buying it and preserving availability for those with the strongest need. Two weeks ago you could have purchased as many PMAGS as you wanted for $12-14 each. Your need at the time was zero so you didn't purchase any. The simple fact is your need is still zero but your emotional mind is overwhelmed by the simple principal of supply and demand. Anyone who can get more than $15 for a PMAG is a genius or just plain lucky.

I have to say it again... No AWB is forthcoming. It just ain't gonna happen.

[Paulo_Santos]

Didn't the same thing happen 4 years ago? Obama, salesman of the year. It is happening again. LOL. I don't see a ban coming. I was at work yesterday and I can't tell you how many people came in for firearms ID cards.

[markm]

I hope I'm not too late to cash in on the TARDFEST. I just last night got to list some Pmags on Gunbroker.

I fear that the imbeciles may have figured out that the sky isn't falling. :(

[FortTom]

Markm,
I haven't hit the "paranoid" phase yet..I've lived through these things before. But....I knew Obama was waiting for his 2nd term to implement his hidden gun agenda. Kept it off the radar during election time and for the most part, debates.
I knew all it would take would be one more insane act and something big is coming. Now you've got to consider that the non-shooting people, people who aren't necessarily anti-gun, just non-shooters are going to react in favor of the lib's propoganda,
because they really don't "see" a need for weapons that can kill 20 6 year olds in a couple of minutes or less, not counting the teachers, and those in Aurora CO. Now Obama has this momentum going for him, and people who normally stay out of the "gun control" frey,
are going to back legislation with what they know, and that is the faces of 6 year olds, mass murdered. It's going to be hard to convince these folks that the "assault" weapon is not the problem. Also, these foks vote. So before i put my hand in, I wouldn't be so brave, or naive as to think that he might not pull off a total ban, if not at the very least a 5 round mag limit, or something to that affect. So, while I respect your opinion, markm, the sky may be falling, at least a little bit.
FT

[gatordev]

I would really like to hear from the perspective of the dealers (Mr. Hwang et al). My thinking, and I welcome their thoughts/corrections, is that part of the issue the last week or two was that this panic happened during the holidays. As a result, the supply channels are at idle. Come January/post-SHOT, stuff will start up again as people come back to work from the holidays and all of a sudden there will be PMags and lowers again (I'm hoping this is the case with Mega...I need a MATEN). It will be up to the individual sellers on whether they want to continue the crazy prices.

For the record, I'm not accusing Rainier, SKD, etc of gouging. Quite the contrary. But rereading the above it may have sounded like that. Apologies if it did.

[FortTom]

Gatordev, I don't think it appears that you're sniping the manufacturer's. This thread started out with the types, like the guy in my hometown, trying to sell an 800 or so buck S&W AR for $3,000 (FIRM), on Armslist. People like that. The funny side, if there is one, is that the local gun stores, and even Dick's Sproting Goods, still has them on the shelves, at slightly dicounted prices. But I will do this, if the local stores try to screw me, I'll remember them when (hopefully) this all blows over, they can go screw themselves, and I'll go out of my way to remind them why.

[Paulo_Santos]

If someone is willing to pay $3000 for an AR that normally costs $1000, that is on them. It was no different than when we had Hurricane Sandy and people were buying $500 generators for $2000.

[Eric]

I can almost see this bill passing right now, given that it is not a full weapons ban. They (the gun grabbers) would be happy to get anything passed that will chip away at our rights.

No Time Wasted: Dems Plan to Introduce High-Capacity Magazine Ban on First Day of Congressional Session

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/house-dems-plan-to-introduce-high-capacity-magazine-ban-on-first-day-of-congressional-session/

House Democrats will waste no time pushing gun control legislation and plan to introduce a bill to ban the production of high-capacity magazines on the first day of the next congressional session, according to the office of Rep. Diana DeGette (D-Colo.), who is co-sponsoring the bill.

The so-called “Large Capacity Ammunition Feeding Device Act” will seek to limit magazines, belts, drums, feed strips and “similar device[s]” to 10 rounds of ammunition. While people who own high-capacity magazines and devices would be able to keep them, they would be prohibited from buying others or transferring existing ones.

“The bill would also exempt retired and current law enforcement officials who use those devices for ‘purposes of law enforcement (whether on or off duty)’ as well as contractors who have been licensed to carry the devices for security purposes required by federal law,” The Huffington Post reports.

Following the tragic shooting in Newtown, Conn. earlier this month, calls for gun control have come from many Democratic lawmakers. Sponsors of the bill, including Rep. Carolyn McCarthy (D-N.Y.) hope the Large Capacity Ammunition Feeding Device Act will be a compromise for Republicans, as opposed to an all-out assault weapons ban, which many strongly oppose.

However, Reps. Tom Petri (R-Wis.) and Chris Stewart (R-Utah) have reportedly expressed some support for a ban on high-capacity magazines.

House Speaker John Boehner (R-Ohio) has not said whether he would allow the bill to the floor for a full vote.

“I’m not so naïve as to think that we can pass some law that will stop a deranged person from taking a gun and shooting people…What I am interested in is making it as difficult as possible for that deranged person to shoot as many people as possible,” DeGette told The Huffington Post in a recent interview.

[FortTom]

Now, today, the sporting goods chain store "Dicks Sporting Goods" has announced that it will no longer sell "Assault Weapons". They had a special on Troy AR's, but are refusing to deliver them, instead, refunding customers money, and giving them a $100 gift card for their "trouble". Dicks cited the recent school shooting as the reason, but took orders for these weapons after the incident. People are joining together for a class action law suit, and according to the article, TROY stands to lose millions that it has invested with an exclusive contract with Dicks Sporting Goods. I don't know what Dick's thinks it will accomplish with this, except for major lawsuits, customer boycotts, etc... I guess to paraphrase Queen Hillary Clinton "It's for the children"... or her other (my personal favorite) "it's symbolic".

FT.
P.S. As of today, I am no longer a customer of Dicks.

[Rodman24]

They certainly have the right to choose what they want to sell, but not only did they decide to stop selling "assault rifles", they decided to make fuss about it.

The good news is that they're still selling these:
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/12/12/31/u4yqa6ub.jpg

What a bunch at Dicks.

[BlindedByScience]

Local big gun store has a SIG716 Patrol on the wall for sale. Was $1800.00, now $5000.00. I get that it's his right to ask anything he wants, still disappointing......

[duc748s]

I kind of have mixed feelings on this.. On one hand if people want to pay 300% + mark-ups on items, then that is there problem. How they spend their money is on them. On the other hand it pisses me off. Currently I am in the process of building a .308 platform for hunting and recently purchased another 15 that replaced one I sold a few years ago. Due to the hoarding, I am stuck with the two 10rnd mags that came with the rifle. The only good part is that due to winter my range trips are fewer and I can wait a month or two till the frenzy subsides.

BTW - 1st post as I finally pulled the trigger and registered. Spent some time lurking about. Great site, and lots of good information, keep up the good work!

[Stickman]

duc748s- Welcome to the board.

[Stickman]

Local big gun store has a SIG716 Patrol on the wall for sale. Was $1800.00, now $5000.00. I get that it's his right to ask anything he wants, still disappointing......


It is very disappointing, but so is that idea that he will probably close up shop or have to fire a bunch of his employees if the proposed AWB goes through.

[GriffonSec]

It is very disappointing, but so is that idea that he will probably close up shop or have to fire a bunch of his employees if the proposed AWB goes through.

Stick,

Interesting point, and it's something I considered after an attempt to order online yesterday. I almost purchased 2 P220 magazines (ban safe! LOL) from a popular online retailer I've ordered from before, and on checkout was given a shipping price of 30.00. Shipping from this particular retailer has always been reasonable, so I'm hoping it was a mistake, and will call them today to verify first.

Your statement runs in line with two points that hit me after the initial irritation yesterday.

1.Supply at user level is about as dry as supply at the dealer level. Once inventory goes down, with limited items coming in month to month, how is a shop supposed to keep it's lights on?

2.Order volume levels ~ I can understand a modest reasonable "handling" charge, since nearly every onine retailer has some sort of "be patient" blurb on their home page due to ordering volumes. Key word here is reasonable.

Was browsing the broker site and saw stripped lowers going for ridiculous prices. I'm OK with a seller starting the bid at a normal retail price, and letting the bid run. I did see a few however, trying to take advantage of it (Noveske Gen 1 lower, stripped, 800 and Umbrella Corp stripped lower at 1550).

Thankfully, I'm satisfied with what I have on hand. Small parts would be nice tho......after all, they're not SN nor do they have the potential to be banned..[crazy]

[Hatter]

It is very disappointing, but so is that idea that he will probably close up shop or have to fire a bunch of his employees if the proposed AWB goes through.

This is what concerns me. Don't get me wrong, I'm a gun nut. It's a hobby, sport, and probably addiction but there are worse things to be addicted to. Price gouging as horrible as it may be, can be endured until things (otherwise normally) slow down. My concern is the amount of American's that will be looking for new lines of work if this craziness continues. Has anyone heard the employment numbers or economic values associated with this industry? How is it that this will escape media attention? Is it the sole fact that liberals will say that these American's working in the firearms industry are the root of all evil? That they can make their money in "sporting" guns or accessories?

[FortTom]

I kind of have mixed feelings on this.. On one hand if people want to pay 300% + mark-ups on items, then that is there problem. How they spend their money is on them. On the other hand it pisses me off. Currently I am in the process of building a .308 platform for hunting and recently purchased another 15 that replaced one I sold a few years ago. Due to the hoarding, I am stuck with the two 10rnd mags that came with the rifle. The only good part is that due to winter my range trips are fewer and I can wait a month or two till the frenzy subsides.

BTW - 1st post as I finally pulled the trigger and registered. Spent some time lurking about. Great site, and lots of good information, keep up the good work!

Something I'm not seeing here. People talking about the "frenzy" subsiding. Sorry, but, and I sincerely hope I'm wrong, but this is not going to fade away. When you have news writers in Des Moine writing about how NRA members should all be killed, gun owners should be drug by vehicles, to give them an awakining, guns confiscated, those not willing to have them confiscated, killed, a call to repeal the second admendment, and Obama free and clear of his second election lock step in line with the author, advocating killing all said gun owners, if you think that this is just going to blow over, I'm sorry. This is it. That's the "calm civil discourse that the Liberals in the DNC talk about so much.) Life as you and I know it, is about to end. The only thing left now, is what we can salvage, and with Democrats controlling the senate, that's not going to be much. I hear chest thumping every day, but another line in that article stated "pry from cold dead hands - Dems are glad to oblige." So, if someone is trying to get an AR before the supply channels dry up, at any cost, I sort of see their point. And then they are proposing registering all "assault" weapons. Next, of course that will be confiscation. I here "let 'em come and get mine, by chest thumpers....hell, when the SWAT team surrounds their house, they'll be crappin and pissin their pants, trying to get those weapons to the "authorities". Piss you off? Yep, me too. But this isn't going to "blow over", and the "frenzy is not going to end" until their are no more to buy.

FT

[Stickman]

I've heard a few different thoughts, one of which is that the only reason things are slowing down is that the supply has dried up. I've also heard the money is gone for many people, so that is the reason for a semi-slow down. While there is no doubt something to be said for each of those, I think it is also very possible people have been spooked, but won't really have it hit them hard until the proposed AWB is thrown down and the news is reporting on it. I think the second panic will be much worse than the first one.

[duc748s]

duc748s- Welcome to the board.

Thanks for the welcome..

Had a long, busy day yesterday. Finally got around to picking up a lower I had brought for my dad, that he never picked up or wanted as of late. He didn't tell me till it was sitting in the shop for ~ 3 months. Luckily the staff at the local shop were excellent and didn't have a problem holding on to it for me. Only issue was a 3 hour drive from my home each way to get there. Made a mental note to stop buy and purchase ammo from them in the future whenever I go to visit my dad to support them.

One a side note, I had to go to the base to take care of a few things and a friend of mine reminded me of a small shop that sold "tactical" related stuff for us, holsters, small parts, bags, packs, etc.. He said to check them out for mags, I never remembered them selling mags. Sure enough they had about 12 PMags on the wall, black windowed Gen 2's. They didn't have the dust covers and were in the new packaging, they also were the same price as prior to the Gen 3. I thought they were lowered? well any way I picked up 3 for my PA range trips, didn't mind the small "extra" cost due to the environment as it stands now.

Then I get a call on the way back home that my Blue box Glock 23 came in and was ready for pick up. I previously had a 22 and a 21, both Gen 1s. I trade those in for the 23, as I hardly shot the 21 (at the time 10mm ammo was tough to get and expensive so I always used the 22) and over time the 22 became my favorite one. Due to a neck injury and nerve damage on my weak shooting side, I needed the smaller barrel length and the lighter weight to help ease sighting when practicing sighting and shooting southpaw. Will I ever shoot that way, probably not, but that's the routine I was taught back in the day so I continue to practice that way. Anyway sorry for the off topic and that's for ;letting me ramble..


Back on topic... The way I see it

The political posturing - This will ease up in time,it already is at this time, as time passes and the horrible trading in CT is not "front page" news. Remember, most of the politicians are media whores, so any time they can get their 5 minutes of fame they will do so at any chance. Will something happen?, unfortunately I think yes, but I think it won't be a drastic as so many are saying. Is it bad either way?, to me as a firearms owner, yes. Only because I feel they are targeting the wrong issues and not concentrating on what's broken with the current laws and restrictions. Hell even that douche Bloomberg is backing off a bit. Being born and raise in NYC, I find Bloomberg's anti-gun crusade ironic. People complain about Cali and their laws, try living in NYC or its boroughs. But that is w whole different topic along with the Supreme Court ruling that there is no expectation of the police to protect individuals.

Supply and Demand.. It seems that after the holidays supply levels are returning, slowly. It won't be like pre-election/Ct levels due to the uncertainty ATM, but it will be better than last month or so. Seems like all the hoarders spent their money :-) What I don't get is why the run on ammo?? I can see the run on 5.56 (if I squint hard enough) but .223?? and other cal types?

Loss of Jobs..etc.. I I really can't see a huge spike in the loss of jobs here. Let's say the AR-15/AR-10 are perma banned, I see shops that focused on building and selling complete rifles either packing up or refocusing elsewhere. But shops that make/sell parts will still be around. There are a hell of a lot of serviceable rifles out there so a demand for parts will be there. Also with the platform on the front page and all the ban talk, it drove a lot of people to the platform and artificially inflated the sell numbers. Some of those sales were back burner sales (people interested but put purchasing on hold due to whatever), but most are hype sales (IMHO). Other manufacturers will just refocus on other stuff, we could even see new rifles and new designs as they look to produce something that complies, and most larger companies make other rifles beside the AR platform. Beside, with our military/LE/etc and other countries using the platform, it's not going anywhere soon.

Thanks for the topic and sorry for the long rant....

[river]

Reps. Carolyn McCarthy (D-N.Y.) and Diana DeGette (D-Colo.) will introduce a proposal Thursday, the first day of the 113th Congress, to ban high-capacity ammunition magazines like those used last month in the Newtown, Conn., elementary school massacre.

Read more: http://thehill.com/homenews/house/275401-democrats-ready-gun-control-bills-for-new-congress#ixzz2GwVPrsiS

It is only going to get worse now. Might go to my local gun shop and watch the chaos...and take them some mercy donuts.

[FortTom]

I seriously hope you're right and I'm wrong....

FT

[mlosi762]

I believe a lot of what's going on is similar to the '08 election. I remember looking at a Springfield Armory M1A Scout a few weeks before that election at my local gun shop, NIB for ~$1200. After the election, (when I had socked away the cash to buy said weapon), the exact same rifle was going for ~$2100. Needless to say, I passed on buying it.

Prior to that back in '01, I remember buying my Glock 19, with 10 round mags. Factory pre-ban 15 round mags were going for upwards of $80-100 each. I didn't buy any.

People who had the stuff that was in high demand raised the prices, which many of us may have thought was price-gouging, but plenty of people actually paid those asking prices. Thats just capitalizing on an opportunity. It's a similar situation that those individuals (myself included) who bought a Playstation 2 back in the day when it was released for $300, saw how much they were selling for on EBay, and sold them to some sucker (I sold mine for $2k). When supply is down and demand is high, what do you expect?

What I see different this go-around, as do all of is here, is that the current attempt to limit these "high capacity ammunition clips (a term I loath BTW)." Or to ban "assault weapons (another loathing term), is nothing more than an attempt to infringe on our 2nd Amendment rights... The new proposed assault weapons ban wants to outlaw sales and/or transfer of any firearm that has "one military characteristic." Well, in my mind, that could mean anything... Every firearm has a trigger, barrel, stock, etc... My Army issued M24 was functionally, and not too cosmetically different from the average Joe's Remington 700. So WTF does military characteristic mean???

I believe that what's happening now is that the left wing is ultimately trying to entirely disarm America by chipping away one piece at a time. "Assault" weapons will be/are their first target. Until someone goes on a shooting spree with a Remington 870/Mossberg 500, they'll be next. After that, some crazy bastard will walk into a school/office/other public place with their semi-auto pistol with multiple 10 round mags and shoot up the place. Pistols will banned.Then someone will use their Remington/Ruger/Winchester/Savage/Browning/Whatever hunting rifle to pick people off from a distance (as if we've never seen that happen), and those will be banned. Once banning certain weapons and magazine capacities start, there may be no end to what plays out.

More importantly, if the Second Amendment does get neutered/repealed, what's to stop other aspects of the Bill of Rights from being subject to the same action(s)? The Bill of Rights was created to protect the people from their government obtaining absolute power over all it's citizens. Start taking those freedoms away, and we will no longer be the United States of America.

I went a little off topic here, but ladies and gentlemen, I believe that we have bigger issues ahead than "price gouging." Call/write your Representatives now. Otherwise the current administration will have their way with you and your guns. If you believe that this assault on your rights is all hype and hearsay, then you are the potential sucker.

[Stickman]

No, I think this is much worse than the election. Obama has made it very clear he wants firearms removed, and he made it a point to not talk about it before the elections.

[mlosi762]

That's exactly what I said is different this time than during the election. You're right, it wasn't mentioned prior to Election Day. Obama waited until he secured his second term to reveal his agenda. I believe dark days are coming for us soon.

[RRAEO22011]

Hello everyone! Board newbie here. Just thought I'd throw my two cents in to get my posts started. I saw an ad locally on craigslist for 10 magpul pmag 30's. They wanted $55.00 a pop for them! A month ago you could get them for $15.00 each! It's crazy!

[Rodman24]

LGS here has almost no AR stock. 1 AAC 300 BLK rifle for $1700 and a few AAC 300 BLK uppers for $1200. They're high but no more so than usual.

[mlosi762]

Cheaper than Dirt has windowless 30rd Gen 2 PMags in stock... $99.95 ea... Ridiculousness...

[Eric]

Cheaper Than Dirt, isn't. They lost my business years ago.

[browcs]

Today, I was quoted an FN SCAR 17S for $5,500.

[Stickman]

Today, I was quoted an FN SCAR 17S for $5,500.


Local, private, or from a online dealer?

[browcs]

Local, private, or from a online dealer?

Dealer in the Miami-area.