PDA

View Full Version : Found a usp 9mm good deal?



LMMzach
13 September 2013, 17:48
Went to pick up my lower from my local ffl holder today and they have a used HK usp 9mm there for 700 they don't want to budge on price I tried. Only one extra clip no carry case. Should I pass on it? Just save and get a p30 or a usp .45 or is that a pretty good deal? I've always wanted a HK handgun but I don't want to get caught up in the moment so I thought I'd ask for some opinions.

UWone77
13 September 2013, 17:59
What's the date code? Is this a full size or compact?

LMMzach
13 September 2013, 18:09
It's full size I'm pretty sure I don't think I've ever seen a compact in person not sure date code any rule of thumb to go by?

LMMzach
13 September 2013, 18:42
They usually say compact on the side don't they? It did not

UWone77
14 September 2013, 03:59
They usually say compact on the side don't they? It did not

Compacts are stamped "Compact" on the side. Date codes near the serial number.

Date Code:

A = 0
B = 1
C = 2
D = 3
E = 4
F = 5
G = 6
H = 7
I = 8
J = 9

So a date code of BD would be 2013 for example.

I think $700 for a full size USP9 with 1 extra magazine is on the high side. I've seen them as low as $500 depending on condition. Compacts usually go for a bit more. Most HK fans would tell you to stick with a 2005 or newer USP. They have a new-style firing pin. The old-style firing pin is more prone to breakage after lots of dry firing. A few other internal parts have been updated over the years as well. Hammer parts, springs, etc. The older guns are fine and no doubt durable and accurate. They just aren't as optimized as current production guns.

Army Chief
14 September 2013, 04:54
Agree. Not that the USP is a bad gun by any means, but if you want a more refined HK in .45 you're really shopping for a HK 45 or HK 45C, and if you are after a 9mm, the P30 or P30L are the current class leaders. Personally, I'm still a 1911 guy for the most part, but when I added a polymer gun to the armamentarium, I opted for a Walther PPQ. Very similar to the P30 ergonomically, striker-fired, reasonably priced (at the time, anyway), excellent quality and easily the best trigger I've found in a plastic gun.

AC

Computalotapus
14 September 2013, 06:36
I'm with AC on this. If you are looking for a 9mm like myself the the Walther PPQ-M2 is it right now. I have been looking for about 5 months. Trying different 9mm out. For the money the PPQ is nice. Fits my hand very comfortable and naturally. The trigger is fantastic. I have looked at Sig's, HK's, S&W, Glock, Bersa, Springfield's and FNH. And the Walther is my pick.

I do want a 1911 but I am hesitant because from what I have heard ( Larry Vicker's interview on Gear Scout ) they can be high maintenance pistols. So I want to find a good gunsmith before I jump into that boat.

Army Chief
14 September 2013, 07:16
My own preference PPQ-wise is actually for the original M1 version with the magazine release levers, vice the new push button release, but both are excellent designs. Definitely a sleeper in the market right now, and easily a peer competitor for the HK.

As I mused elsewhere not so long ago, the 1911 is like a fine fountain pen: if you don't mind learning its idiosyncrasies and you invest in quality up-front, there is no reason not to use and enjoy these guns; that said, most shooters will be better served by more modern, simpler and easier-to-maintain pistols. Vickers' comments were on-point, of course, but you have to keep in mind that he's coming from the perspective of hard-use service applications, and in that environment, the knowledge base and support trains necessary to keep these guns running is no longer what it once was.

The 1911 is not a particularly high-maintenance pistol, but it does require a level of intellectual investment and care that aren't really necessary with the typical Glock, M&P or HK. The mistake that most would-be 1911 owners make is that they want as many features as they can get for as little money as possible, and the pistols produced for that end of the market tend to suffer from poor fitting and inferior parts quality. The other problem is that folks get enamoured with subcompacts and other non-standard reduced form factors, without having any innate understanding of the physics of the gun, and just how close some of these models come to the margins of acceptable performance.

Finally, this matter of price point has to be considered carefully. The 1911 is now over a century old, and while vast strides have been made with the design over that period of time, it remains true that the gun was conceived in a time when technology was expensive and skilled labor was cheap. Today, we have just the opposite, and yet, the design parameters of the gun still require a great deal of hand-fitting under competent hands. That takes bench time, and bench time is expensive. The bare minimum of acceptability that I would accept in a production-grade gun is a Colt, and even then, there are a number of small -- and not-so-small -- things that can, and should, be done to bring those guns up to a more refined standard.

Bottom line? If you want to enter the 1911 game, and you don't have about $2,000 to throw into the effort (say, a quality base gun and a few simple upgrades), then you're probably better-served by selecting something else.

AC

Computalotapus
14 September 2013, 07:27
AC I agree completely on the 1911. I know that my budget for one is going to be in the $2500-$3500 range. I don't want it to be an EDC so I'm looking at the Commander. Seriously thinking of caspian frame and slide and have caspian fit them. I would like some night sights on it and a good trigger job. Other than that keep it close to the stock look. I need a gunsmith and a good one at that. Unfortunately those are hard to find locally. The idea of shipping it to and from to get work done doesn't sit well with me. I'm the type of person that needs that relationship with another to express my want/needs when it comes to this.

I will own one someday.

Army Chief
14 September 2013, 07:41
I don't get too wrapped-up around finding local talent for serious 1911 work. Shipping back and forth is not a significant issue, really, but wait times can admittedly be quite long for the best of the best.

Depending upon where you are in Michigan, you might want to give Ned Christensen a call. I'll bet he could get you properly sorted-out, if he has any space on his calendar. Definitely a premier smith at the national level. http://www.m-guns.com

Alternatively, you could probably just do very well by shopping for a used Wilson Combat model that suits you. This is often the best point-of-entry for these guns because the quality is above reproach, and the customer satisfaction policy is pretty much best-in-class. It is also a less confusing way to go for guys who are newer to the 1911, and not always sure what does/does not belong on the gun.

AC

Computalotapus
14 September 2013, 08:02
Thanks Chief I will look him up and inquire.

browcs
14 September 2013, 08:28
My own preference PPQ-wise is actually for the original M1 version with the magazine release levers, vice the new push button release, but both are excellent designs. Definitely a sleeper in the market right now, and easily a peer competitor for the HK.

AC

Agreed. I love Walther's offerings since they came out with the P99-series. Not a huge fan of the switch from the paddle to current button mag release though. I greatly regret not getting a first gen PPQ 9mm when I had a chance as I really do prefer the Walther paddle mag release system followed by the HK mag releases over anything else. Now, if I find that version of PPQ they are either $100-$150 over what they usually were. Instead of getting a PPQ, I went to a Caracal, which is a fine shooter but not without significant problems given the recalls of the F and C versions of the gun. In .45 ACP, I prefer my USP .45 ACP full-size over the Walther/S&W collaboration SW99 .45 ACP as I find the USP's grip slightly more ergonomic and the USP is a 12+1 firearm versus the SW99 which is a 9+1.

Computalotapus
14 September 2013, 09:03
Rumor has it the M1 will surface again in the US around the first of next year

browcs
14 September 2013, 11:09
Rumor has it the M1 will surface again in the US around the first of next year

That would be nice....as would a PPQ Compact with the paddle release.

LMMzach
14 September 2013, 18:53
I love this forum.

I am def not in the market for a 1911 right now I'm still building my AR just want to get a pistol in the meantime. I've always wanted a HK usp. 45 or 9mm would be alright I thought I'd get a 9 so down the road I could get a 1911 since they are 45. I might go up Monday and try to put wit them maybe they can drop the price I think I'd be okay with 6 out the door if its newer than 05. Other than that ill probably just save another couple hundred and get a p30.

IRacknBack
15 September 2013, 19:04
I found a real decent condition USP 9 LEO trade in on hkspecialist.net a couple years ago. It came with 2 18rd magazines, jet funnel, and worn night sights for around $450 + shipping/transfer. I have seen them on the secondary market more than once for $600ish range so I would pass at $700 with only 1 mag personally. Ok guns. Sig 226/9 much better in my opinion.