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dialM4murder
15 August 2007, 15:48
Is it really necessary for my carbine length system?

Stickman
15 August 2007, 16:04
It depends on what you do, what your expectations are for the weapon, and ammo that you shoot.

If the sole purpose of the weapon system is to shoot slow fire on a static range, it probably isn't something that will ever make a difference or be noticed. While there are threads that cover the technical aspects of why it delays BCG movement and smooths the gas pulse, the more important thing for me (IMHO) is that an increase in reliability, smoother firing sequence, and allowance for follow up shots is a win-win scenario in my book.

Its also probably worth pointing out that the difference gained is not massive, and many people don't shoot enough to feel the change between a standard and "H" buffer. I know guys who can't feel the difference when I drop in the H3 or 9mm buffer, but thats due to their lack of familiarity with the weapon system in my eyes. Someone dialed in to their weapon feels it pretty quick, and I don't know anyone who hasn't liked the switch.

dialM4murder
16 August 2007, 13:46
Ok, so slowing down the cycling increases the reliability. Good to know.

My primary use is plinking, HD, and any potential SHTF scenario.

Stickman
16 August 2007, 14:28
Slowing down the cycle can be good, but you wouldn't want to go over board. Going with a super heavy buffer, along with an increased power buffer spring can cause problems when shooting lighter/ weaker ammo.

Quib
16 August 2007, 20:50
I definitely noticed a difference in perceived recoil with the addition of “H” buffers in my M4gery and my HD carbine.

m24shooter
19 August 2007, 15:34
I put an H buffer in my M4 and it noticeably slowed my operation down. It smoothed it out and made the cycle not as sharp, especially with the hotter loads.

riverider4741
20 August 2007, 16:25
I bought the Endine Hydraulic Buffer I read a good write up about it in the G&A Handbook of the AR. Found it at Brownells if I don't like it you can return anything there no questions asked

http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=22351&title=AR-15+AR-RESTOR?

markm
17 September 2007, 09:59
Interesting.

I just realized that I've only had H buffers in all of my Carbeans. I can't even say if I can tell the difference since I've never fired the standard buffer.

The H buffer is what came with my Factory Colt AR15-A3 tactical carbine, so I've always just set up every one of my carbines the same way.

Stickman
17 September 2007, 17:28
markm,

While we are certainly off the original topic, if you are bored, and get the chance, drop in a 9mm buffer. The more in tune a shooter is with their weapon, the greater the perceived difference.

RyanS
17 September 2007, 20:43
In terms of increasing the reliablity, and also the longevity of parts, is there any way to know if you should go with an H2 or H3 over the standard H buffer? I run a 6920, the buffer and spring are just as they came from the factory...is there a better combo?

markm
18 September 2007, 08:36
In terms of increasing the reliablity, and also the longevity of parts, is there any way to know if you should go with an H2 or H3 over the standard H buffer? I run a 6920, the buffer and spring are just as they came from the factory...is there a better combo?


I wouldn't mess with it!

Stickman
18 September 2007, 17:36
"Better" is a relative term. While there are a lot of things you could do to alter the recoil impulse, you would be affecting overall reliability. In the same manner that you can tune a race car, you can tune your AR15/ M16. Just like a race car doesn't like regular fuel, its very possible to tune your AR so that it gets picky over what it likes...

I doubt the H2 buffer would hurt it any, but you could see issues with lower powered .223 loads.

RyanS
18 September 2007, 18:19
I doubt the H2 buffer would hurt it any, but you could see issues with lower powered .223 loads.

Like the RG garbage that I can't get rid fast enough. Seemed like a good idea at the time of purchase for range fodder, but I'm getting tired of perfecting failure drills.

markm
19 September 2007, 06:39
Like the RG garbage that I can't get rid fast enough. Seemed like a good idea at the time of purchase for range fodder, but I'm getting tired of perfecting failure drills.

That sucks. My brother in law bought some of that. Mr. Know-it-all won't listen to me when I tell him that several guys have had problems with the ammo. He insists that it was how he was lubing the weapon.[crazy]

gotm4
21 September 2007, 05:10
I run at least a (3.8oz) H buffer in any AR that has a carbine length gas system and a (4.57oz) H2 in SBRs (12.5" and under) or in any that I shoot suppressed or ones with KX3s. I've run H3s in SBRs and Enidines but prefer much prefer the H2s.

In mid-length ARs (unless their suppressed) I run (2.9oz) standard CAR buffers (if suppressed I run an H buffer).

For 18"-20" ARs with rifle length gas systems and carbine stocks I use a (2.9oz) standard CAR buffer.

I also use a 'Crane O-ring or MGI Dfender' in any AR with a carbine length gas system.

RyanS
21 September 2007, 10:51
I run at least a (3.8oz) H buffer in any AR that has a carbine length gas system... I also use a 'Crane O-ring or MGI Dfender' in any AR with a carbine length gas system.

What springs do you use? Thanks.

gotm4
21 September 2007, 12:49
What springs do you use? Thanks.

Standard power CAR springs. Sometimes chrome silicon standard power one when I can get them.

TigerStripe
11 October 2007, 16:38
If you're running a standard carbine or H buffer you will definitely notice the difference when you switch to a 9mm or Enidine AR-restor. There isn't anywhere near as much muzzle jump with a 9mm compared to an H.


TS

Marlow
30 October 2007, 06:50
I put a h-buffer in my P.O.F. and I believe it improved my ability to get back on target quickly. It also made the rifle more comfortable to fire.. Granted, a 5.56 isn't a mule to begin with, but if it can be more comfortable, why not make the change... I would also guess that it would improve the service life of the bolt carrier.

Redfisher
3 November 2007, 17:27
Considering the H Buffer is standard in nearly every top line manufacturer's carbine, I would say it is a good idea to upgrade yours. It is inexpensive insurance and easy to install.

Going to the H2, H3, HX, or even 9mm buffers would be a decision based on factors too numerous to make a blanket statement on.


edit: reading is fundamental :confused: Yea, like Gotm4 says, std CAR spring is GTG

TigerStripe
3 November 2007, 23:27
I say trying a 9mm buffer won't hurt. Try it, if it works keep it in. I have 9mm buffers in both my DI and my POF. Very noticeable difference.


TS

chuckles
15 November 2007, 08:33
What are potential issues to look for when switching to an H buffer AND a Wolff XP spring at the same time? Is that a no-no or should it be gtg? It is a S&W 15T btw.

gotm4
16 November 2007, 04:45
What are potential issues to look for when switching to an H buffer AND a Wolff XP spring at the same time? Is that a no-no or should it be gtg? It is a S&W 15T btw.

You could cause your AR to short cycle which may not allow it to lock back the bolt when empty or it may not pick up the next live round in the magazine but will eject the empty. If you have both what you can do is load 1 round per mag and fire it testing if it'll lock back empty. Do this at least 10 times with the rifle well lubed. Shoot about 100 rounds or so and then try it again with the rifle dirty but well lubed. If it doesn't lock back even once go back to a standard rate spring or use a CAR buffer with the Wolff spring. I also highly suggest that you have one of the gas block screws dimpled into the barrel to prevent it from shifting and making your AR a single shot.

guam50
24 November 2007, 13:07
I bought the Endine Hydraulic Buffer I read a good write up about it in the G&A Handbook of the AR...

I run the carbine enidine on my 6.8SPC 16" without any problems. I had to switch out my rifle enidine on my 6.8SPC 18" with a standard rifle buffer for it to run reliably (getting FTFs). All my other ARs in .223/5.56 run an H-buffer with no problems using factory or handloaded ammo.

fogofwar
25 November 2007, 16:04
My experience is that the H Buffer takes the recoil from a slap (and a girly slap at that) to a slow thud. No big deal really when you are running regular loads though your machine. If you go with suppressors and fancy ammo or other mods then it may have a more tangible benefit as to reliability, control, etc. I got it just to try it with regular loads and I like the thud instead of the slap so I'm keeping it in. As has been said by more sage persons than I above--be careful about what you modify or you can turn a marevelously reliable machine into a big question mark.

english kanigit
17 January 2008, 22:16
Sorry to hijack...

Whilst on the thought of reducing recoil impulse does anyone have thoughts on running a -16 bolt carrier in their gun? Would it offer any distinct differences versus a H Buffer? In conjunction with?

I've been wondering about doing this on my carbine.
Ek :o






BTW- this is a nice place. Good threads/info everything is cut and dried with a minimum of foolishness. It's refreshing.

TigerStripe
17 January 2008, 22:36
Sorry to hijack...

Whilst on the thought of reducing recoil impulse does anyone have thoughts on running a -16 bolt carrier in their gun? Would it offer any distinct differences versus a H Buffer? In conjunction with?

I've been wondering about doing this on my carbine.
Ek :o


BTW- this is a nice place. Good threads/info everything is cut and dried with a minimum of foolishness. It's refreshing.

I see no negatives to running an M16 carrier in your rifle or carbine, unless your state law prevents it. The M16 carrier is the weight and design meant to be in an AR. I don't run one because I haven't gotten around to doing it yet (money).

Eric
18 January 2008, 00:32
Hi EK. Fist off...welcome!
Like TS said, there really is no downside to using what is referred to as the M16 carrier, which is actually the original configuration. By swapping out carriers, you're really not going to notice much, if any change in the felt recoil.

If I were building a weapon from parts, I would order the M16 carrier, but I wouldn't sweat it if my AR15 carrier was otherwise functional.