AR-15 Safety Selector Question

[John Moses]

Hey guys. I have several AR-15's and all but one will allow me to select the safety to "safe" when the bolt is locked back on an empty mag. I don't know why, but I like to flip the safety on when changing mags at the range so if I am letting someone shoot it, and they install a new mag and drop the bolt catch, its still on safety if they are not as familiar with the platform. I know this may not be neccessary, and I know that everyone has an opinion on the safety etc. My real question is how "should" it work, and the only reason I can tell y "one" rifle (Spikes Lower) will not do this is if the Bolt is pressing down on the hammer too much when the bolt is back. Thoughts?

Thanks guys.

[Hmac]

Thoughts?

All of my rifles gave the same configuration BADASS specifically so I never have to ask questions like this.

[AR-10]

Did you perform a function check after assembling this lower?

Take the upper off, and cock the hammer manually.

Does the selector work?

What parts kit did you use and what trigger do you have?

[John Moses]

Yes the function test is fine. The lower is a Spikes, and the LPK is a Spikes enhanced with the NIBX trigger and hammer. The selector works fine with the upper off, and as I said, It is only one of about 15 AR's i have built that does this. With the upper on, and the bolt locked back after the mag empties, the safety selector is tough to get into "Safe" . This can happen when the hammer, while in the cocking position is pressed down slightly more than normal. I was wondering if anyone else had seen this before, as I suspect it may be the BCG pressing down a hair too much on the hammer which can cause the back of the trigger to rise, and interfere with the safety operation.




ETA: So after swaping uppers and lowers around, it appears that it really only happens with the spikes Triggers. (I have 3 lowers with them) It appears that as the BCG comes back it puts downward pressure on the hammer which closes up the gap where the safety and the trigger engage at the back of the trigger. The standard Mil-spec Triggers I tested have more slop in the safety , but allows me to engage the safety with the bolt locked back.

Is the safety supposed to engage (flip to the SAFE position) with the bolt locked back on an empty mag?? Is really what I would like to know, if so the Spikes Triggers will not allow for this.

[John Moses]

I found another thread, and basically a lot of guys with the ALG triggers used in the Spikes kits have the same problem. It is a defect in the hammer cam area, and a combo of the NIB added that throws the things out of whack. I have an email into Spikes Tech, and hopefully they replace the hammers. The AR-15 should in fact switch to SAFE with the bolt locked back.


here is the link that explains it https://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=3&f=66&t=580412

[Eric]

The AR-15 should in fact switch to SAFE... Correct. I have never come across one that does not. Let us know how this resolves.

[UWone77]

I found another thread, and basically a lot of guys with the ALG triggers used in the Spikes kits have the same problem. It is a defect in the hammer cam area, and a combo of the NIB added that throws the things out of whack. I have an email into Spikes Tech, and hopefully they replace the hammers. The AR-15 should in fact switch to SAFE with the bolt locked back.


here is the link that explains it https://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=3&f=66&t=580412

I was just about to ask you what happens when you swap uppers. Sounds like you've isolated the problem with the lowers with Spikes Triggers. All of them are Nickel Boron coated right? Perhaps you got a batch of out of spec hammers. Did you buy them all at the same time?

I probably run about a 1/2 dozen ALG ACT triggers, and I've read elsewhere the coating sometimes causes problems, but I haven't experienced that with any of my triggers. Do you have another non-coated hammer you can throw in to see what happens in those same lowers?

[John Moses]

I purchased them all around the same time during the panic last year, and have just gotten around to using them. At first I thought it was the Detent, as I have had them "grind" for lack of a better word, so I pulled it and it had gun butter on it, so it definitely wasn't that. I had two guns at the range this weekend, and going between the Noveske and the Spikes I noticed one (the Noveske) worked fine, and the other did not. The Noveske has a RRA 2 Stage. I can try another hammer , but I noticed the Trigger area around the disconnector is also coated.

The only way I can see to "fix" it would be to remove some material from the "flat" that is machined into the Safety Lug. I do not know the hardness, and if this is safe to do, but I liken it to fitting the thumb safety on a 1911, which I have done quite a few times. If I really pres hard on the Safety, it will go into Safe, but obviously that is not right. I'll see what Spikes says, as they are always good to work with.

Thanks UWone77, and also thank you for the Givaway you did last week with Stick.

[John Moses]

Just a report back. I contacted Spikes with the problem. Their one and only response was " Do you have a NIB BCG"....after clearly describing to him (Derrick) what was goig on, and telling him I had a Spikes Phophate BCG, I have yet to hear back from them in any form or fashion.

Anyway. I tried 3 uppers on this lower....same issue. I replaced safety selectors.....same issue. I replaced the hammer...issue better. I replaced FCG and all uppers worked flawlessly.

Upon inspection I noticed the very back area of the trigger, that engages the safety had a high spot or "casting edge" similar to what a MIM part would have. I am not sure if Mil-spec triggers are MIM or not, but I believe they are. It appears Spikes simply sends out a Mil Spec trigger for NIB coating, and nothing more. I cleaned up the back of the trigger, re installed and it functions perfectly.

For good measure, I ordered a SSA from DSg Arms........LOL. Thanks guys.

[UWone77]

I'm sure some people loves Spikes and have had good experiences with them, but what does having a Nib BCG have anything to do with your problem?

Glad you figured out the issues on your gun. You'll be happy with the SSA, even if it is just a tad more money.