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View Full Version : Benelli vs. FN vs. ?



jeffy
15 August 2008, 21:00
I'm looking to buy my first shotgun. I've had some time behind a 870 Wingmaster and loved it. I loved it so much, I don't want to buy one. [crazy] I'm thinking that I'd be better suited with a autoloader. So here's the criteria. I want something for HD/SHTF. I don't plan on clearing rooms at home but rather taking up a defensive stance if something goes bump in the night. I'd also like to be able to shot some clay. Not Sporting clay or trap. Just some backyard fun.

Whenever someone says shotgun, the first thing that pops into many minds is Benelli. I don't think I'll be getting a M4. I don't have to have everything the mil uses. [BD] I think a M2 or a M3 might be a good choice. What I'm worried about with the M2 is will it be able to feed the lighter loads OK. Also, will having a pistol grip stock affect the inertia system? I'm still not sure if I want a straight stock or a pistol grip stock. Pro's/Con's? I've never shot a shotgun with a pistol grip stock.

Now the other stick that comes up fairly often in 3-gun seems to be the FN SLP. How does it stack up to the Benelli's? IIRC, it's based off of the Winchester X2. Another thing to consider is price. I was told from a reseller that the SLP jumped in price significantly since early this year. There is the SLP MK1 which is a little different. I kinda like the 22" models with the 8+1+1 but that gooseneck rail, not so much. I prefer the ghost ring sights. I noticed that FN does not make a straight stock 22" SLP in the US but does for other markets. Seems strange. They do have a tactical in 22" though.

Is there anything else comparable to these? Mossberg 930 SPX seems to be a lesser to the FN. Cost wise, it's not much of a savings over the 22" MK1 that I've seen from Ray Tanners on Gun Broker.

I don't know much about the Remington 11-83. Is that comparable? Or should jump ship and just go with a Remington 870P or Mossberg 590A1....

gotm4
16 August 2008, 03:54
I really have been doing well with my FN SLP Mk1 in 3gun. It's the gun you would want if you want to be able to shoot everything from light clays rounds to 3" slugs. Mine came with 2 pistons. One is for 1.5oz or lighter and the heavy piston is for 1.5oz or heavier loads. Although mine runs great with the 1.5oz light piston on Wal-Mart bulk Federal lo-brass 7-1/2s I still bought the lightest piston available from Brownells (it's the Browning Gold Sporting Clays piston). It's made for 1-1/8oz or lighter shells. I also replaced the recoil spring with the Browning Gold 3.5" recoil spring. The one that came out of my gun looked just like the new one (The FN might already be upgraded to this spring), supposedly the Winchester SX2 had a lighter spring. I sold my M1 Benelli to get this, the Benelli was just too finicky with lighter loads. I shortened my handguard and beveled out the loading port because a few times in practice and in my first match I didn't get the round all the way to the shell stops, after the work it hasn't happened again. I'm using a 3gungear.com side saddle and 2 shot handguard saddle. I use Briley extended chokes in Light Modified and Improved Cylinder. The flip up rear sight is pretty much useless for slug. With my Federal Truball reduced recoil slugs it's hits 5-6" too high even with the rear sight adjusted all the way down. So I just leave it flipped down and use the gutter of the scope mount and use the front aligned within it and can make decent 50yd hits. I also bought a Nordic Components 1 shot mag extension for the few outlaw 3gun matches I shoot that don't have mag capacity restrictions. So I can actually then get 9 in the mag tube, 1 on the carrier and 1 in the chamber.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/gotm4/gunpics/FNshotgun.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/gotm4/gunpics/fnshotgun2.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/gotm4/gunpics/fnshotgunfrontsightchoke.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/gotm4/gunpics/fnshotgunloadingport.jpg

jeffy
16 August 2008, 23:03
I've still got to see what kind of prices I can get on the Benelli before I make a choice but it does look like the SLP has the edge. I can't believe the SLP's price shot up so much after it's introduction though. $300 is pretty steep when you compare the price with the MKI.

I'm kind of torn between the different sight systems. Basically it comes down to the Rifle and the Ghost Ring sight for either the Benelli or the FN. I'm used to shooting with the bead. What's your take on it? I don't think I'll be shooting slugs.

gotm4
17 August 2008, 07:07
I like the fiber optic. My Benelli had a ghost ring and large military type protected front. I can shoot either well. The fiber is a little faster. On GunBroker Tanners is selling the FN SLP MK1 for $680 at the Buy It Now price.

Cohibra45
17 August 2008, 09:05
I know I'm a dinosaur, but I like blue steel and nice wood stock. For me, I have been looking at the Benelli Legacy with 26"[:D][:D][:D]!!!

Just my .02 worth.

Cohibra45

jeffy
17 August 2008, 18:14
I know I'm a dinosaur, but I like blue steel and nice wood stock. For me, I have been looking at the Benelli Legacy with 26"[:D][:D][:D]!!!

Just my .02 worth.

Cohibra45
Oh, I've been considering something old school as well. I want to eventually get either a Winchester 97 Riot or a Norinco/IAC Model 97 Trench. IAC said Norinco moved their SG plant and are trying to get it started back up. This means their stock is currently non existent. The Model 97 Riots are popular with the cowboy crowd. I figure I wouldn't really want to use something like this for HS/SHTF though. Might be too finicky.

I'm really leaning towards the FN SLP MKI though.

Dutch
17 August 2008, 19:27
Well, I guess it's my turn to give opinion.

I have not shot the Benelli Mk2/3, though I do have rounds logged on the Nova. I have extensive rounds logged on the FN SLP MK1, Mossberg 500, 590and Remington 870.


I currently own, the Remingtin 870, Mossyberg 590, and FN SLP Mk1

Duty Shotgun is Benelli Nova or Remington 870

The 870 has the most felt recoil, the Nova has the least in my opinion

The 870 has a bead front sight, the Nova and 590 have rifle sights, and the FN has a flip up wedge with a fiber optic front "bead"

The 870 is the slowest of the pump shotguns, and the Nova in my opion has the least felt recoil.

Currently only FN SLP's and MK1's in country currently are available as importation has been stopped by ATF. This is not to say they will not be available again later, but who knows when that date will be, hopefully later this year. Something to do with parts. ( This info was provided by the FN Rep)

Hope some of this helps, if you have more Q's just ask.

Dutch

jeffy
17 August 2008, 20:36
I currently own, the Remingtin 870, Mossyberg 590, and FN SLP Mk1

Duty Shotgun is Benelli Nova ot Remington 870

Dutch

So, you don't see the FN as being able to take on HD/SHTF roll?

Dutch
17 August 2008, 20:40
I never said that, nor meant to imply the idea.

Duty = what shot gun the boss bought me to carry and use

HD/SHTF = Mossberg 590 (shorter, and very solid) not detracting from the FN at all

Dutch

jeffy
17 August 2008, 21:39
Ah sorry, I must have read too much into that.

I have thought about getting a pump-action and have looked into the 870P, 590A1, Nova and the SuperNova as well. I'll be the primary used of the gun but there is an off change the GF might have to use it. She's fivefootnothing and maybe 110 soaking wet. Now this is all speculation but, I'd be worried that she might short stroke it under pressure. She could also rest the gun against the bed so she's doesn't have to carry the weight. This would make using the pump a bit difficult.

That's one of the minor points that lead me to to where I am. Length, I would assume, would be moot?

Dutch
18 August 2008, 10:13
Jeffy,

I would never take length as being a "moot" point. If you would like you GF to use the weapon, for fun or protection you need to take her ability to handle and manipulate the controls nad features of the weapon you purchase. If it is too long,heavy, or requires higher level of skill to make work she will not be interested in it. I know you said you are will be the primary user, but if she is part of your equation you need to factor her into it.

Have you looked at the Mossy 930? Its a autoloader, 18.5 barrel, with the option to get a longer barrel. It might meet your requirements?

Dutch

jeffy
18 August 2008, 11:30
Jeffy,

I would never take length as being a "moot" point. If you would like you GF to use the weapon, for fun or protection you need to take her ability to handle and manipulate the controls nad features of the weapon you purchase. If it is too long,heavy, or requires higher level of skill to make work she will not be interested in it. I know you said you are will be the primary user, but if she is part of your equation you need to factor her into it.

Have you looked at the Mossy 930? Its a autoloader, 18.5 barrel, with the option to get a longer barrel. It might meet your requirements?

Dutch

What I meant was the difference between 22" and 18.5" (or 20" in the case of the 590A1).

I have looked into the 930 (first post) but from all accounts the FN is built better. And if there isn't that much of a difference in price then, why go with the lesser of the two?[pop]

Dutch
18 August 2008, 19:55
Jeffy,

Good luck on which ever shotgun you pickup. I am sure it will serve you well.

From what I have seen the FN will run you about $800 give or take

The mossberg should be closer to $500

Dutch

austin12gauge
19 August 2008, 04:29
Is there anything else comparable to these? Mossberg 930 SPX seems to be a lesser to the FN. Cost wise, it's not much of a savings over the 22" MK1 that I've seen from Ray Tanners on Gun Broker.
M24 is well experienced with the 930 SPX and has posted an extensive review here: http://www.weaponevolution.com/forum/showthread.php?t=167

jeffy
19 August 2008, 14:29
I read the first part of that review when it first appeared. Nit picky or not, I would have liked to seen a more critical review. I would have liked to have known where the money went, so to speak. The receiver seems to be aluminum like all of the other Mossbergs and has their advantages and shortcomings (which was mentioned). What about the internals? Do they show tool marks, are they gritty, etc... It was mentioned the safety was plastic and from the pictures it looked like the trigger housing was plastic as well. From that I'd guess it's more like a 500 then a 590A1, but is that true? I would have also liked to have seen it compared with others in the same market. Price-wise, the Mossberg seems to have them beat but really what's the best value (price vs quality).

I've seen the breakdowns between the 500 vs 590A1 and the Remington 870 Express vs. Marine vs. Police vs. Wingmaster. These breakdowns have made it easier to see what is a better value and helps explain where the money is going. As a result, it makes the choice much easier.

Is Benelli the best? Many seem to think so. FN's are just rebadged Winchesters. From my understanding anything tactical is pushed to the FN line-up. FN doesn't seem to have the brand recognition as Benelli does. Does this reflect in the price difference or is there a quality difference as well? Does the FN have better value because they are not as well known?

Also, can an autoloader be a dependable when used for HD? From reading the many different shotgun threads here and there, pumps seem to reign supreme. But one has to question why. Is it's because pumps are cheaper? I'm sure you get many who want a M4 but are only willing to pay for a Express which artificially tips the scale a bit. Even on Gunbroker, the Express covers the majority of the shogun section.

But I digress, what would you consider in my situation. Also, if anyone would like briefly to go in-depth with any particular model, please feel free to do so.

I should mention what I've found on pricing since that might change some things. The Benelli M2 Tactical price locally is around $1239. The M3 with the pistol grip stock is around $1339. The FN SLP MKI is $679. I haven't checked other shotguns though. The Mossberg 930 SPX has a MSRP of $667. I know the Remington 870 Police and Mossberg 590A1 are less.

[pop]

austin12gauge
19 August 2008, 14:55
The 930 SPX goes for $525 (last time I looked) at my local cop shop, GT Distributors. They don't list it in their online catalog, but I have seen it in the store. Online, they show the M590A1 at $440. They dropped the 870P lineup. http://www.gtdist.com/ProductDetail.aspx?PartNumber=MOSS-51663

m24shooter
19 August 2008, 16:25
I read the first part of that review when it first appeared. Nit picky or not, I would have liked to seen a more critical review. I would have liked to have known where the money went, so to speak.
If there is anything that I've missed that you want to know after this post let me know and I'll try to include it in another follow up. I should have an update in about the next month.
As far as a critical review, the review was actually done before I joined here. It wasn't so much a head to head comparison, but more as an attempt to provide a single source of info on the SPX. There is a ton of info on Benellis, Remingtons, and FNs out there. At the time that it was done, all the info on the SPX was basically done word of mouth and on boards. There was next to no information available. The Mossberg site was totally devoid of details, and most of the discussion was "It's a Mossberg so it's a POS" by those that either hadn't seen one or couldn't figure out how to operate one. There were several people on several boards talking about it, but that's about it.
My review was an effort to provide the details that I wanted to know before buying it to others that were considering the SPX. I did leave some info out, and now that you mention some of those, it was an oversight on my part not to relate some basic info. However, if there is another place with more info on the SPX than what I have out there, I haven't seen it.

The receiver seems to be aluminum like all of the other Mossbergs and has their advantages and shortcomings (which was mentioned). What about the internals? Do they show tool marks, are they gritty, etc...
The internals actually are very clean. No tool marks, and the trigger is smooth. I'll get a scale on it to get the pull weight for you. I did it before but I don't remember exactly what it was and I didn't write it down.

It was mentioned the safety was plastic and from the pictures it looked like the trigger housing was plastic as well.
The safety was plastic, which I didn't like. The trigger guard is aluminum.

From that I'd guess it's more like a 500 then a 590A1, but is that true?
Based on those criteria, it is kind of both in that it has the plastic safety but a metal trigger guard. And keep in mind that the 590A1 was built to Marine requests, and relatively few of them were sold/put into service. The vast majority of Mossbergs recently purchased by the .mil have been the 500s.
For the next review I'll post some pics of the SPX internals along with the other stuff I've been working on.

I would have also liked to have seen it compared with others in the same market. Price-wise, the Mossberg seems to have them beat but really what's the best value (price vs quality).
Well, like I said the info on the other shotguns is everywhere. If I went point by point in comparison of other shotguns, the review would be even longer than it was, and it is already fairly large. As far as the best value, that's an individual decision. In saying the same market I don't know if you meant the same price point or just tactical semis as a whole. For the money, there isn't another one.

I've seen the breakdowns between the 500 vs 590A1 and the Remington 870 Express vs. Marine vs. Police vs. Wingmaster. These breakdowns have made it easier to see what is a better value and helps explain where the money is going. As a result, it makes the choice much easier.
Like I said, if there is anything else that you want to know about the SPX let me know and I'll try to get it together for another update.


Also, can an autoloader be a dependable when used for HD? From reading the many different shotgun threads here and there, pumps seem to reign supreme. But one has to question why. Is it's because pumps are cheaper?
Cost is certainly a factor. Pumps will have a strong following because they have been around so long, are not sensitive to ammunition selection, and provide the ability do things unique to shotguns (select slug, LL rounds, breaching, etc). The semis have just started to reach a point where they are consistently reliable, although many still display ammo sensitivity.

I'm sure you get many who want a M4 but are only willing to pay for a Express which artificially tips the scale a bit. Even on Gunbroker, the Express covers the majority of the shogun section.
And that is why it would be difficult for me to answer your earlier question about what is the best value honestly. That can only be answered by the purchaser.

The Mossberg 930 SPX has a MSRP of $667. I know the Remington 870 Police and Mossberg 590A1 are less.

The SPX usually runs about $525-560. I've seen it above that, but I think that is a little too much unless you are absolutely set on one and that's the only price you can find on one at.

parabellum
19 August 2008, 17:56
watching this thread closely. i need an autoloader for 3-gun as well - my pump just isn't cutting it.

i should have taken the hint at my first match when i was the only competitor in the field with a pump action [BD]

leaning towards the 930, but the FN looks nice too. like Benellis, but i have a bad habit of pinching my thumb when i load them :( i know its a training issue, but its painful and embarrassing one, and would hurt my time worse than anything in a competition.

jeffy
19 August 2008, 20:10
If there is anything that I've missed that you want to know after this post let me know and I'll try to include it in another follow up. I should have an update in about the next month.


Thanks for the incite. Have you used a FN or a Benelli before getting the Mossberg? The SPX really looks like a SLP clone. Outwardly, they look very similar. How would you compare it with your 590A1? Which would you grab for?


watching this thread closely. i need an autoloader for 3-gun as well - my pump just isn't cutting it.

i should have taken the hint at my first match when i was the only competitor in the field with a pump action [BD]

leaning towards the 930, but the FN looks nice too. like Benellis, but i have a bad habit of pinching my thumb when i load them :( i know its a training issue, but its painful and embarrassing one, and would hurt my time worse than anything in a competition.

So, I'm not the only one here! Seems like a lot of lurkers here. Another stick, I'm trying to get some info on is the Benelli M2 Field 21". It's supposedly popular with the 3-gun crowd as well.

Feel free to ask anything else I may be forgetting in this thread.

m24shooter
19 August 2008, 20:37
Thanks for the incite. Have you used a FN or a Benelli before getting the Mossberg? The SPX really looks like a SLP clone. Outwardly, they look very similar. How would you compare it with your 590A1? Which would you grab for?
I've owned one M3S90 and two M1S90s. The M3 was a gimmick gun. The M1s were nice, and shot well. However at the time service for Benellis was total crap. I did not like being ignored because I was not making a department purchase, and parts were hard to come by from sources outside of HK. I sold all three because of a total lack of support.
I haven't used an FN shotgun. They aren't really that popular around me. That isn't saying that they aren't good; it is just that the 870, 500, and 590 pretty much have dominated for so long that there just isn't much of a market around here for anything else.
As far as comparing the SPX to my A1, I really find myself using the SPX a lot more as I have gotten used to it. The SPX handles better, at least in part because it doesn't have that heavy barrel. The 590A1 holds one more round, but it is noticeably heavier while still being lighter than a decked out 870P. The SPX seems to be a little easier on the recoil, although that really doesn't bother me much anyway. The SPX has been as reliable as my A1, but I've not yet had it for a year. Time will tell if it is as durable. The A1 I have had for 8 years. In terms of fun, the SPX is a lot more fun to shoot if that matters to you.

jeffy
20 August 2008, 12:33
Thanks for the insight. It's been a while since Benelli was imported by HK. I'm sure things have changed a bit since then. I know HK can be a bear to deal with so that probably didn't help. I'd hate to be spending 12-1300 and run into any issues. the other problem I've been reading about is if I did want to change anything on the Benelli, I'd have to make sure it's still 922 compliant and Benelli isn't helping by giving a parts count. The other problem is my state limits autoloaders with pistol grips to 4+1. I guess it's because they're too accurate when shooting from the hip. [crazy] The dealer I talked to said Benelli isn't making the standard stock M3 anymore either. [bash]

So, I guess the Gods are against me getting a Benelli. :confused:

That leaves the Winchester SX2, FN SLP MKI and possibly the Mossberg SPX. Oh and maybe the Benelli M2 Field 21" since it's more 'friendly'. The Winchester SX2 would be a bit harder to find though since they have discontinued it. The only difference between it and the FN is it has the 22" barrel and has Ghost Sights. I'm not sold on either the rifle or ghost yet. Think an Aimpoint would do well on there? Maybe a H-1 or T-1?

parabellum
1 September 2008, 03:16
I think i might take the plunge on the 930 SPX this week. will either get another Aimpoint Micro for it or perhaps a Burris fastfire.

Since i'm getting it for 3-gun i think the Choate mag extension is a must-buy. just not sure if i should go for a 3, 4 or (gasp) 5 round mag extension.

12+1 does sound pretty good to me tho. any drawbacks to a 5 round mag extension, besides the weight, balance and strange aesthetics? i think i'd be able to live with all of those just fine as long as the reliability wasn't effected and the handling wasn't made too awkward by the 5 round mag extension.

jeffy
1 September 2008, 13:14
Cool, let us know how that turns out.

I'm still on a temporary hold. I found a 930 SPX locally but they wanted too much. For a bit more I could jsut buy the FN, which is probably want I'll be eventually doing.

I've got a few more things to buy for my AR before I can move on.

parabellum
2 September 2008, 11:35
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v205/parabellum9x19mm/0902081240a.jpg

I paid $565.95. Just got it today, hope to shoot it very soon.



I'll try not to repeat too much of what m24shooter has already stated in his excellent 930 SPX review here. My initial impressions are that its definitely a Mossberg and as such it seems to be a great value item. It exhibits same look and feel that any Mossberg owner is already used to. everything is right where you'd expect it to be.

fit and finish is also Mossberg though and through, in that its very good, but not perfect. The finish is a black manganese phosphate and is very evenly and thickly applied. My fit issue is with the plastic handguard on the fore-end, there is a little play there and the furniture feels cheap. There are no visible tool marks on the exterior of the weapon and more importantly, very few tool marks on the interior of the receiver and bolt.

The bolt itself is very smooth, with gloss black finish and has a grooved, flat charging handle, with an oval profile. I'm not crazy about the charging handle. I wish there was more to grab. A beefier, round bolt handle, such as on the Benelli Super 90 would be much better.

The bolt release is a large, checkered button with positive feel when disengaged. The placement is a bit far forward for my taste, it is possible to have your hand whacked by the bolt handle when slammed home, but thinking of it another way, this is good placement for the button when you are reloading...when the mag is full your thumb is already right at the button.

Like m24shooter, I find that I really like the cocking indicator inside the trigger guard. The trigger itself has a much lighter pull and is more crisp than the 500/590.

The only other semi automatic shotgun I have experience with is the Benelli Super 90 M1 and M3. In comparison the 930 SPX is lighter. The 930 is much much much easier to load for me (my major gripe with the Benelli). The 930's safety is in a better location for me, but the bolt handle is inferior to the Super 90. The 930 is much less expensive. However,the Super 90 feels much more solid. It feels like you could bang in railway ties with the Benelli all morning and then shoot a few hundred slugs in the afternoon without a hitch.

I purchased an Uncle Mike's 5 round shell holder, cuff style on the butt stock. I just need some more shell holders to go around the fore-end...I'm also kicking around the idea of adding a round or two with a magazine extension.

All said and done, I like it a lot. Much cheaper than an FN SLP, Super 90, 1100, Franchi....hopefully it will hold up and shoot well. If it does, I will be very happy with my purchase. Thanks alot to m24shooter, I had been very curious about the 930, but his review really helped out my decision making process and as of right I don't think I could have made a better choice. Thanks!

jeffy
2 September 2008, 11:59
See, that's a lot cheaper then what they want for one here. The place I went to had it for $650. Which is only $29 less then a FN SLP MKI from RT. Not to mention, there won't be the 8.25% tax on it. Then there is the DROS which is $65-75...

Stickman
2 September 2008, 15:45
It seems like an easier way to look at things is to figure what you can spend, and then go from there.

Whats your target price range?

jeffy
2 September 2008, 17:00
It seems like an easier way to look at things is to figure what you can spend, and then go from there.

Whats your target price range?

My budget would be, Sub-$1000.

m24shooter
2 September 2008, 19:18
I'll try not to repeat too much of what m24shooter has already stated in his excellent 930 SPX review here.
Thanks for the praise.

My fit issue is with the plastic handguard on the fore-end, there is a little play there and the furniture feels cheap.
Almost all of this can be eliminated by tightening down on the extension. Use some padded pliers. It can be pretty much eliminated completely by using one of the sling mounts.

I'm not crazy about the charging handle. I wish there was more to grab. A beefier, round bolt handle, such as on the Benelli Super 90 would be much better.
MAX100 is your answer there.

The bolt release is a large, checkered button with positive feel when disengaged. The placement is a bit far forward for my taste, it is possible to have your hand whacked by the bolt handle when slammed home, but thinking of it another way, this is good placement for the button when you are reloading...when the mag is full your thumb is already right at the button.
I'm not sure that I'm tracking you here. The bolt is already forward when you're loading the mag tube and it sounds like you are loading with your right hand.
Are you right handed? If so try loading with your left hand, that should help with the issue as well as being faster and keeping your firing grip on the shotgun. Feed the first round into the ejection port from underneath the receiver cradled across your fingers and slapping it into the open port. As you bring your hand downward press the bolt release with your index finger. On mine this is a little easier after cutting the foreend back. It provides a natural mechanical stop to index my hand on for hitting the bolt release and also when tube loading. Then feed the rounds into the mag with your left hand.

The trigger itself has a much lighter pull and is more crisp than the 500/590.
Mine runs between 5 and 5.5#.

I purchased an Uncle Mike's 5 round shell holder, cuff style on the butt stock.
This may not be an issue for you, but those make it difficult to uncomfortable to shoot from your left shoulder. If you won't ever be doing that, then it would not be a problem for you.

Thanks alot to m24shooter, I had been very curious about the 930, but his review really helped out my decision making process and as of right I don't think I could have made a better choice. Thanks!
Glad you found the review helpful. Make sure you clean it well before you start shooting to get rid of the factory snot in it, and if you have some early ammo sensitivity issues run loads at or above 1300 fps, then work it down. I haven't had any issues with any loads, but there have been some for others.