RECOIL Magazine

[Thompson]

I've been eyeying up RECOIL's magazine since last fall, and I was thinking about subscribing. I was wondering if anyone here has read any of their magazines; in other words, is it worth the subscription? or should I put money elsewhere?

On the subject of magazines, are there any other good ones out there? I'm looking for something more modern (AR-15, survival, tactical type stuff) --> which is what RECOIL magazines seem to be. I don't really have an interest in the hunting side of the house.

[GOST]

They had a lot of bad press from their MP-7 scandal, but besides that it's a very nice magazine. Only complaint is that it's a extremely expensive magazine. I personally like it better than the other offerings out there, the John Noveske and Paul Buffoni articles were very cool.

[Thompson]

Yes - I've heard about the rumbles regarding the MP7 article. A bit on the expensive side - probably why I'd get the digital subscription if I do get it. The Paul Buffoni article is probably why I'd spend $9 to get that one magazine haha.

[Pyzik]

"Ink and Iron" just came out with their first issue this month. Looks like a pretty cool rag to me. I can't remember the last magazine I subscribed to, maybe "Maxim" about 8 years ago...?
I am considering a subscription to this though.

Their first issue is available online as a downloadable PDF for free if you want to check it out.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/nm4jswa29nyd7f4/INK%20AND%20IRON%20ISSUE%20ONE%20EPUB.pdf

I saved a copy in my Drive account you can view without downloading. Though, the colors didn't come out right for some reason.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5f15xtHrDqzSmdDREJGMUZlN1k/edit?usp=sharing

[UWone77]

Recoil had their issues like you guys mentioned, but I really enjoy the magazine itself. It's expensive, because the magazine itself uses high quality material. Is it necessary? Probably not.

I enjoy the articles and photographs. For the most part, they are easy to read, touch on topics I enjoy, but yes, $10 an issue is hard to swallow for some. I personally prefer a physical copy to read vs an iPad Version. I guess I need to flip the pages, kind of how I enjoy always reading a physical copy of Car & Driver.

If you happen to pick up the order issues, make sure you pick up Issue #11, I might have written the Mega Arms Article in that one. [:D]

[FortTom]

I've bought about 3 copy's of RECOIL, including the first one. If you want reviews on uniforms that cost $500 bucks each for Blouse and Trousers (yeah $1 Grand without accessories), if you want to learn how to build a "kick ass" bug out truck for around 100K, plus cost of truck, 10K night vision systems, 5 to 10K "tactical" watches, and other such things, the very wealthy can afford, by all means, go for it. I can't afford any of that stuff, but it is entertaining, to say the least. World of Fire Power is a quarterly that equals RECOIL in quality of materials and reviews and stories, but they cover items that are within the realm of possibility of being affordable. Take your pick.

FT

[UWone77]

I've bought about 3 copy's of RECOIL, including the first one. If you want reviews on uniforms that cost $500 bucks each for Blouse and Trousers (yeah $1 Grand without accessories), if you want to learn how to build a "kick ass" bug out truck for around 100K, plus cost of truck, 10K night vision systems, 5 to 10K "tactical" watches, and other such things, the very wealthy can afford, by all means, go for it. I can't afford any of that stuff, but it is entertaining, to say the least. World of Fire Power is a quarterly that equals RECOIL in quality of materials and reviews and stories, but they cover items that are within the realm of possibility of being affordable. Take your pick.

FT

That's part of the reason I read magazines... to look at items I'll never buy or can afford. Why do Car magazines feature exotics that most of us will never be able to afford?

But but but.... does that mean you're not going with the 100K Bug out vehicle FT?

[rob_s]

Personally, I found the MP7 thing to be indicative of a much larger issue that I prefer not to be involved with, but the truth is that the fluff articles and whiz-bang photography of the magazine were just as equally indicative.

The bottom line is that the publishers see guns like they saw the tuner import cars they were writing and publishing about before that: a status symbol, a cool-guy hobby, and a bunch of flash and not a lot of burn. The content is exactly what you'd expect with that kind of mentality: superficial.

I understand that I am the oddball in the firearms market, and that magazines like Recoil cater to the very masses that keep the industry machine turning. Thank God. If there weren't millions of barbie-builders to entice companies to innovate, the 0.01% of new firearms and accessories that are actually useful would never get made.

[UWone77]

Personally, I found the MP7 thing to be indicative of a much larger issue that I prefer not to be involved with, but the truth is that the fluff articles and whiz-bang photography of the magazine were just as equally indicative.

The bottom line is that the publishers see guns like they saw the tuner import cars they were writing and publishing about before that: a status symbol, a cool-guy hobby, and a bunch of flash and not a lot of burn. The content is exactly what you'd expect with that kind of mentality: superficial.

I understand that I am the oddball in the firearms market, and that magazines like Recoil cater to the very masses that keep the industry machine turning. Thank God. If there weren't millions of barbie-builders to entice companies to innovate, the 0.01% of new firearms and accessories that are actually useful would never get made.


rob you know how it is... it's all about looks, that's what sells. I remember a quote you had a few years back, something to the effect of I'll take a shooter with a DPMS over a poser with a High End Rifle. Pretty much sums up a lot of the market, but that's what 99.9% of the market caters to. I like to see a balance of both, as I think there is room for the high round count civvy shooter and the safe queen curators.

[Liberal_Strong]

Along with recoil I enjoy world of firepower which is something similar but more military based. I guess for recoils ptivre it can be justified for its bi monthly release vs the traditional once a month, then that's way too much. I haven't read about the mp7 thing but heard about it and regardless of it, its still a quality gun magazine. Its large, colorful, and I think I get my monies worth.

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[FortTom]

That's part of the reason I read magazines... to look at items I'll never buy or can afford. Why do Car magazines feature exotics that most of us will never be able to afford?

But but but.... does that mean you're not going with the 100K Bug out vehicle FT?

Not until I get the $500 trousers. You don't expect me to sit in those seats wearing G.I. issue, or Wranglers, do you???[:)]

FT

[Thompson]

Recoil had their issues like you guys mentioned, but I really enjoy the magazine itself. It's expensive, because the magazine itself uses high quality material. Is it necessary? Probably not.

I enjoy the articles and photographs. For the most part, they are easy to read, touch on topics I enjoy, but yes, $10 an issue is hard to swallow for some. I personally prefer a physical copy to read vs an iPad Version. I guess I need to flip the pages, kind of how I enjoy always reading a physical copy of Car & Driver.

If you happen to pick up the order issues, make sure you pick up Issue #11, I might have written the Mega Arms Article in that one. [:D]
Yes ... I'm with you there. I'd much rather have a printed copy - then I could highlight to my heart's content (and well, print's better anyways for reading magazines I think). Which is what will unfortunately drive me to the digital magazines if I do get them. Will definitely pick up Issue #11 if I do subscribe (which is likely)!

Pyrzik - thanks for that. Will have to take a look at "Ink and Iron"!

FortTom - will have to take a look at World of Firepower too, especially since it's more MIL based.

[FortTom]

FortTom - will have to take a look at World of Firepower too, especially since it's more MIL based.

It's not necessarily just MIL based. They review a lot of stuff that is within the realm of possibility for most wallets. Things like Inforce WML lights, Good alternatives to the Harris Bipod, Aimpoint RDS, rather than a 9K scope, that sort of thing. Obviously, if a guy is building one or two rifles a year, or more, I'd guess most folks that do that have some "disposable" income, and can fork out the change to complete their rifle with quality components, but RECOIL, up to when I quit buying it, was catering to the "bottomless pocket" crowd. Some of it, just plain silly, as far as affordability. I'd bet that less than 5% of their readership could afford half the stuff they focus on.

Like it was said earlier, it's fun to look at the uber expensive cool stuff, like a Lamborghini in a car magazine, or something, but I'd rather read reviews on things that are more realistic, in my world.

Others worlds, may be much different, and have a half dozen more zero's trailing their net worth, than I do. So, to those folks, enjoy![:D]

FT

[Computalotapus]

I like looking through RECOIL and OFFGRID magazine. I tend to pick them up when I see them on the shelf at the local food store, and sometimes my wife surprises me and brings one home. I agree that 99% of the stuff in there is out of my price range. I will have to look into World of Firepower, I have not noticed it at my local shops. I wish there was something out there that helped use poor souls find good products at a price we could afford. I know a lot of the gear/clothes looks nice but I can not afford a $450 wind breaker or $200 pair of pants to toss in a bug out bag. Hell a $100 belt made me choke and if it wasn't for my wife I wouldn't own it.

For clothes I find nothing wrong with Condor and Propper. Every now and then I will spring for some 5.11 gear. But none of it makes me a better shooter..so I tend to spend my money on ammo and targets and getting my butt out to the range, and eventually taking some classes and progressing. Unfortunately some of these classes require you to have some light gear to keep the flow of the lesson moving along.

[GOST]

I also like looking at Recoil but have only purchased the John Noveske issue. I don't really own much so called tactical stuff, I'm more of a farm guy who plays mostly with shotguns and bolt action rifles. I am fortunate enough to over 160 acres to play on and raised in the military, I also have an honorable discharge. To me Recoil magazine is like reading a fictional novel, unrealistic but fun and pretty.

[rob_s]

rob you know how it is... it's all about looks, that's what sells. I remember a quote you had a few years back, something to the effect of I'll take a shooter with a DPMS over a poser with a High End Rifle. Pretty much sums up a lot of the market, but that's what 99.9% of the market caters to. I like to see a balance of both, as I think there is room for the high round count civvy shooter and the safe queen curators.

I find that, of the print media, SWAT falls more in line with what my interested are. Or were. So me may think that's me being biased since I have had articles published in SWAT, but I sought them out as a venue for my stuff because I thought they best matched my take on things at the time.

What I would like to see now is a magazine aimed at the functional gun owner. Not the Internet Barbie builder, not he hardcore SWAT commando ninja or his wannabe brother, just the average guy that actually gets out and shoots. A focus on 3-gun, IDPA, USPSA, etc. would be good, plus a focus on the average road cop or infantryman. Well, wait, not average... Average within the rarefied group that is actually interested in the performance of their guns and related gear, not average in the whole who sees their guns and gear no differently than their pens or boots.

The problem is that my magazine wouldn't sell. What we found running our own training company is that nobody wants reality, and that fantasy is what sells. A competition shooter and a road cop offered to teach people how to get better and offered a metric to measure improvement, and we closed our doors while a guy who doesn't deny rumors that he was SAS and a guy who wraps his truck and runs around teaching people how to survive gunfights without ever having been in one are both still in business.

The mass market wants the fantasy. And RECOIL certainly caters to that in spades. Hell, most of the guys that THINK they're all about reality are actually living in some kind of lala land.

[schambers]

boots are important!

Just sayin'

[Computalotapus]

boots are important!

Just sayin'




Yes they are and I don't need an expensive magazine trying to sell me expensive boots when Original Swat takes care of me at a decent price.

...just sayin.

[FortTom]

Yes they are and I don't need an expensive magazine trying to sell me expensive boots when Original Swat takes care of me at a decent price.

...just sayin.

That and several other previously mentioned things, make me wonder how much longevity that RECOIL magazine will have. These publications rely heavily on advertisers. I've read anecdotal information stating that subscription and store sales, only generate enough income to produce the magazines and get them into the hands of the reader.

I don't know if that's true or not. Maybe someone with professional experience in magazine production and revenues might come forward and shed some firsthand experience and confirm that or prove it false.

Point being, after the cool factor wears off, it only took me about 3 issues or so, most folks aren't going to be buying the advertisers products, such as the $1000 per set BDU's, and other items usually only affordable by Spec Op's units with unlimited budgets. Or the 1K each tires with the "cool" bullets molded into the outside, to go on their 100K bug out trucks.

I'm going to take an admittedly uneducated guess here, and say that when these companies can't recoup advertising dollars, from the "regular guy/gal" and their realistic budgets, they'll pull advertising dollars, and if RECOIL doesn't come down to earth, they'll fold, in more ways than one (pun semi-intended).

Agree? Disagree? Have experience on the financial side of publications? Please weigh in.

Comp, good call on the boots. Good boots are expensive. I paid $150 for a pair of Merrill hiking boots last year, for backpacking and didn't even get them broke in before my neck vertebrae surgery ended my season for about 6 mos. or more. I checked out the Origional Swat boots, and may give them a try for an all around "out in the woods" boot.

FT[:D]

[Thompson]

Hmmm I guess maybe I'll have to look for other options (ie: World of Firepower) for subscription .. guess RECOIL will stay on when I go window shopping.

Regarding boots, haven't had much experience with buying them, but OpticsPlanet seems to have good prices on them (and they offer LEO/MIL discounts too!). Got a set of BlackHawk Warrior Wear boots to replace my not so great standard issue Altimas, for about $100 (MSRP: $160).

[Airborne_EWO]

Hmmm I guess maybe I'll have to look for other options (ie: World of Firepower) for subscription .. guess RECOIL will stay on when I go window shopping.

Regarding boots, haven't had much experience with buying them, but OpticsPlanet seems to have good prices on them (and they offer LEO/MIL discounts too!). Got a set of BlackHawk Warrior Wear boots to replace my not so great standard issue Altimas, for about $100 (MSRP: $160).

Blackhawk boots are super comfortable, but the rubber soles wear out far too quickly for the cost. JMO after owning a few pair of them.

Sent from the center of the universe!

[Thompson]

Blackhawk boots are super comfortable, but the rubber soles wear out far too quickly for the cost. JMO after owning a few pair of them.
Did not know that. What boots do you wear then?

Also had the chance to check out an issue at the local grocery store. Very flashy as everyone has stated ... and sadly items more on the pricy side.

[GOST]

I like Salewa boots. Comfortable, built like a tank and great soles.

[Airborne_EWO]

Did not know that. What boots do you wear then?

Don't get me wrong, I really liked the Blackhawk boots that I had, but they wore out too soon for me. I went through a pair in less than 2 months in Afghanistan and another in about a year when not deployed. I still have a pair that I wear off and on.

Any recommendation for a good boot needs to be prefaced with the question: what do you plan on using them for?

I am currently working my way through a pair of Nike SFB's. They are really comfortable and provide good, but not great, support. I have had them for a little over a year, and think they will probably last another 6 months or so.

A really great all around boot is the Garmont T8. Super comfortable, great support, and long lasting soles. I would also recommend a USGI standaard issue or ripple sole boot from Altama (though I see you're not too fond of these) as they will last a long time and can be good to go with the right insole insert.

A lot of guys that I work with really like the Rocky C4T boots, but I have no personal experience with them. I would also say to stay away from Belleville Flyweights as the heel cup is extremely tall and will rub pretty bad on your ankles.


Sent from the center of the universe!

[Thompson]

Any recommendation for a good boot needs to be prefaced with the question: what do you plan on using them for?
At least for the next 3.5 years, ROTC, and then into Big Army afterwards. (I also have flat feet if that makes a difference; I generally wear my set of inserts in my boots)

[Airborne_EWO]

At least for the next 3.5 years, ROTC, and then into Big Army afterwards. (I also have flat feet if that makes a difference; I generally wear my set of inserts in my boots)

First, congrats on getting accpeted into ROTC. Any clue as to what branch you want?

If you are only going to be wearing them every so often and not every day, the Blackhawks should easily last you a couple years. Just watch the seams as they have a tendancy to use cheaper thread in some parts, but they might warranty that if it happens too soon.

If you plan on wearing them more often and want them to last thru summer Airborne/Ranger courses and or LDAC then I would definitely recommend the Garmont T8s. They are some of the best boots for Army stuff you will find. Garmont, just recently, started making them in wide sizes as well, if needed. The most important thing is to make sure they fit your feet properly, especially with your own insert. Far too often issue boots are given out that do not fit correctly and that is where a ton of the issues come from.

Thread hijack done...back to our regularly scheduled discussion.

I checked out Recoil at B&N the other day, and while it looks very well put together with some decent articles I would definitely not pay the ~$8 they wanted for it.

Sent from the center of the universe!