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Naytwan
18 November 2014, 07:44
This is more of an overview than a full review. I will be taking the optic out and doing some shooting and hopefully a carbine class in the beginning of the year.

First the box contents.

https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5615/15817989781_48ffdaba06_b.jpg

They included a fair amount of stuff needed to start with including some thread locker.

The optic itself seems about the same size as the older red dot but looks like it has a bigger opening in the front. Glass also looks less blue than the original. Note the cheap mount seems legit but may be a tad tall. It's on the older model red dot.

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7530/15817989751_53193aa9a1_b.jpg

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7508/15634058659_245dcb1709_b.jpg

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7522/15634701297_3ca91e2238_b.jpg

https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5614/15634058549_4b98099d73_b.jpg

https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5606/15817989721_c16ed849f8_b.jpg

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7533/15635032910_f6befa7134_b.jpg

I really wanna see if the 50K battery life is legit. I have had it on since I opened the box. I set it to about 2 clicks blow where it came from the factory. That seemed about right for indoor/home defense use. I’m hoping to get to the range tomorrow and zero it. Will report back once I get a few rounds threw it. So far I'm liking it.

https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5606/15634463628_4194d456b6_b.jpg[

DutyUse
18 November 2014, 08:23
One issue I have with my last gen is it washes out really bad in bright sun. Have you got to shoot this one outdoors yet?

Thanks for the review. Keep us posted.

KevinBLC
18 November 2014, 13:28
Thanks for the quick overview. This one is definitely on the "to-buy" list for sure.

voodoo_man
18 November 2014, 14:31
sweet review!

FortTom
18 November 2014, 14:45
It appears that the emitter (blob in lower right at approx. 5 O' clock) is still apparent. I had read in a review that many found this annoying, and it was supposed to have been reconfigured so it's not in ones field of view. Maybe that is the way you took the photo? Is it still apparent when looking at it from the perspective of being mounted on a rifle? That would be a deal breaker for me. I was seriously considering one of these, over another H1, but now I'm not so sure. So, do you still see it when looking through it in a shooting position?

Thanks,

FT

GOST
18 November 2014, 15:02
FT the emitter on the new ones is hardly noticeable, far from the glob in the previous versions. Did not realize that the front lense was larger. Thanks for the great review.

Naytwan
18 November 2014, 19:09
One issue I have with my last gen is it washes out really bad in bright sun. Have you got to shoot this one outdoors yet?

Thanks for the review. Keep us posted.

I have not. Hopefully I can get it out this weekend outdoors.

Naytwan
18 November 2014, 19:11
It appears that the emitter (blob in lower right at approx. 5 O' clock) is still apparent. I had read in a review that many found this annoying, and it was supposed to have been reconfigured so it's not in ones field of view. Maybe that is the way you took the photo? Is it still apparent when looking at it from the perspective of being mounted on a rifle? That would be a deal breaker for me. I was seriously considering one of these, over another H1, but now I'm not so sure. So, do you still see it when looking through it in a shooting position?

Thanks,

FT

You can barely see it. Its much smaller than the older model. The reason it looks big in the photo above is due to the angle it was taken at.

FortTom
18 November 2014, 19:46
You can barely see it. Its much smaller than the older model. The reason it looks big in the photo above is due to the angle it was taken at.
Thanks Naytwan. The older one was actually distracting to me, and that was going to be a deal breaker for me. I'm looking to buy another H1, but considering a PA, or a Vortex SPARC II. Don't know anyone that has either, except the older model PA, nor does anyone around here have one in stock that I could "play" with for a few minutes. The H1 (I own one) is a proven entity while the PA and the Vortex, I'll have to rely on someone who has one. Be sure to let us know how you like your PA, when you get a chance to get it to the range. Your review looks promising so far, but I'd like to hear the rest of it.

Thanks,

FT

Naytwan
18 November 2014, 20:22
https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5609/15639454480_f9c4927dba_b.jpg

I took this photo as close to the same angles as possible. You can really see the difference in the emitter size. Still running for over 24 hours now BTW.

FortTom
18 November 2014, 20:50
WOW!! Naytwan... that is a major difference!! Thanks for taking and posting these pics. Primary arms really did address that issue. Old version looks like it's got a wad of chewing tobacco in it [:D]

That was really my only issue I had with it, and now it looks like a non-issue.


Thanks,

FT

Still running after 24hrs. ? Only 49,976 hours until that test is over...[:D]

Naytwan
3 December 2014, 17:55
I finally got a chance o take it to the range. Just indoors at 25 yards but I needed to get a 50 yard zero. I still need to go to 50 and confirm but its on now. One thing I noticed is the smaller opening and my 38 year old laser corrected eyes agree with it. The dot didn't bloom as much as on my aimpoint pro. Oh and the site has been on since the day it arrived and its still running fine. Hopefully in a couple weeks I will be able to take it out in the daylight and see how the dot looks in bright sun. I have taken it out doors but its a different ball game mounted to a rifle and trying to pick up a dot against a target.

FortTom
3 December 2014, 18:58
I finally got a chance o take it to the range. Just indoors at 25 yards but I needed to get a 50 yard zero. I still need to go to 50 and confirm but its on now. One thing I noticed is the smaller opening and my 38 year old laser corrected eyes agree with it. The dot didn't bloom as much as on my aimpoint pro. Oh and the site has been on since the day it arrived and its still running fine. Hopefully in a couple weeks I will be able to take it out in the daylight and see how the dot looks in bright sun. I have taken it out doors but its a different ball game mounted to a rifle and trying to pick up a dot against a target.
Maybe you can put a dot on the neighbors cat? Seriosly, keep us posted, been watching this and waiting for your conclusions.

FT

MoxyDave
3 December 2014, 19:00
I had the older model out last weekend on my Sig 522. On the highest setting with fresh batteries, the dot was visible at High Noon in the bright Colorado sun, but it was easily lost.

My Aimpoint Micro has a much brighter dot.

For the price Primary Arms makes a solid red dot and this new one looks even better. Great sight for a plinker/range toy but I would not want to use one on a duty gun. Battery life and dot brightness are far below the Aimpoint Micro.

Also I tend to accidentally leave it on after every range trip, killing the battery by the next time I take it out. I'm used to the Micro which I just leave on all the time, seems to last forever.

Naytwan
3 December 2014, 19:55
I had the older model out last weekend on my Sig 522. On the highest setting with fresh batteries, the dot was visible at High Noon in the bright Colorado sun, but it was easily lost.

My Aimpoint Micro has a much brighter dot.

For the price Primary Arms makes a solid red dot and this new one looks even better. Great sight for a plinker/range toy but I would not want to use one on a duty gun. Battery life and dot brightness are far below the Aimpoint Micro.

Also I tend to accidentally leave it on after every range trip, killing the battery by the next time I take it out. I'm used to the Micro which I just leave on all the time, seems to last forever.

That's the beauty of the new dot. Its supposed to have 50K hour battery life. Its been on for 2 weeks now.

MoxyDave
3 December 2014, 20:22
Ah my fault I totally missed that. 50K is right on par with AimPoint! Looking forward to seeing if it actually works that long [:)]

Kopis
4 December 2014, 06:49
damn i knew i shouldve got one of these on BF but it wasnt high on my "need" list! Ive got two of their other ones. Theyre not bad for the money. Big improvement in the emitter visibility and battery life. Maybe they'll have a christmas deal soon.

FortTom
6 January 2015, 20:28
I just bought one of these. At first, I had buyer's remorse almost immediately. I bought the RDS and the ADM QD mount in a package deal. I started asking myself, almost as soon as I hit the place order now button, why in the heck didn't I just pop for another H1, and have been done with it. It wasn't a good feeling.

I have to admit, after receiving it, that within an hour or so, I was truly impressed. The buttons on top for dot intensity take a bit to get used to, but it's a pretty easy transition. It's been really rainy or cold as hell here, so I haven't had a chance to get it to the range, but during one rare particularly bright and sunny days, the visibility of the dots in the bright sun were pretty much exactly equal. Even the number of "clicks" of the buttons on the Primary Arms or the "clicks" on the battery cover for the Aimpoint, pprox. 7 or 8, result in an almost identical dot as far as brightness and intensity, and just happen to be magic number for me.

The PA seem very solidly built, the spec's are about the same for an H1, and the dot looks good, even in super bright light. I'm still reserving final judgment until I can get a warm day and my club opens the range up, but I've lost a whole lot of that sick feeling in my stomach, that I really screwed up. I think I'm going to really like this RDS, unless it just goes haywire . I probably would not have bought it, had PA not moved the battery to the side. Good move on their part. I think if these things are tough enough to stand up to rigorous use, as the YouBoob videos show, PA's may sell a boatload of these. We'll see.

Also, I have to thank PA's for the incredibly fast shipping, especially during the holidays, don't know how they did it.

Thanks for the review, Naywan. Hoping to hear an update from you.[:D]

FT

DutyUse
6 January 2015, 20:50
I just bought one of these. At first, I had buyer's remorse almost immediately. I bought the RDS and the ADM QD mount in a package deal. I started asking myself, almost as soon as I hit the place order now button, why in the heck didn't I just pop for another H1, and have been done with it. It wasn't a good feeling.

I have to admit, after receiving it, that within an hour or so, I was truly impressed. The buttons on top for dot intensity take a bit to get used to, but it's a pretty easy transition. It's been really rainy or cold as hell here, so I haven't had a chance to get it to the range, but during one rare particularly bright and sunny days, the visibility of the dots in the bright sun were pretty much exactly equal. Even the number of "clicks" of the buttons on the Primary Arms or the "clicks" on the battery cover for the Aimpoint, pprox. 7 or 8, result in an almost identical dot as far as brightness and intensity, and just happen to be magic number for me.

The PA seem very solidly built, the spec's are about the same for an H1, and the dot looks good, even in super bright light. I'm still reserving final judgment until I can get a warm day and my club opens the range up, but I've lost a whole lot of that sick feeling in my stomach, that I really screwed up. I think I'm going to really like this RDS, unless it just goes haywire . I probably would not have bought it, had PA not moved the battery to the side. Good move on their part. I think if these things are tough enough to stand up to rigorous use, as the YouBoob videos show, PA's may sell a boatload of these. We'll see.

Also, I have to thank PA's for the incredibly fast shipping, especially during the holidays, don't know how they did it.

Thanks for the review, Naywan. Hoping to hear an update from you.[:D]

FT

Got my 2nd to newest generation when they first came out, and this sucker has taken some solid licks I was sure would a broke glass, nope still perfect. I also popped for the ADM mount combo and glad I did, holds zero and still haven't had to replace batteries on mine yet ( not a 50k rated). I'm really impressed with Primary Arms as a whole, and for around our little farm it's just about the perfect lil rifle optic, durable enough to take a fall from a 9' tree stand, but inexpensive enough I wouldn't be to bummed if I broke it.

Naytwan
8 January 2015, 15:06
I just bought one of these. At first, I had buyer's remorse almost immediately. I bought the RDS and the ADM QD mount in a package deal. I started asking myself, almost as soon as I hit the place order now button, why in the heck didn't I just pop for another H1, and have been done with it. It wasn't a good feeling.

I have to admit, after receiving it, that within an hour or so, I was truly impressed. The buttons on top for dot intensity take a bit to get used to, but it's a pretty easy transition. It's been really rainy or cold as hell here, so I haven't had a chance to get it to the range, but during one rare particularly bright and sunny days, the visibility of the dots in the bright sun were pretty much exactly equal. Even the number of "clicks" of the buttons on the Primary Arms or the "clicks" on the battery cover for the Aimpoint, pprox. 7 or 8, result in an almost identical dot as far as brightness and intensity, and just happen to be magic number for me.

The PA seem very solidly built, the spec's are about the same for an H1, and the dot looks good, even in super bright light. I'm still reserving final judgment until I can get a warm day and my club opens the range up, but I've lost a whole lot of that sick feeling in my stomach, that I really screwed up. I think I'm going to really like this RDS, unless it just goes haywire . I probably would not have bought it, had PA not moved the battery to the side. Good move on their part. I think if these things are tough enough to stand up to rigorous use, as the YouBoob videos show, PA's may sell a boatload of these. We'll see.

Also, I have to thank PA's for the incredibly fast shipping, especially during the holidays, don't know how they did it.

Thanks for the review, Naywan. Hoping to hear an update from you.[:D]

FT

Ive been doing a lot of indoor range shooting with it. I love it so far and its still running, has been on since it arrived. Trying to wait for a formal update to the review till I can get outdoors. I did compare the dot to my aimpoint pro and it seems a little cleaner to me. I think your going to enjoy the optic.

FortTom
8 January 2015, 15:50
I was comparing mine, side-by-side, to an Aimpoint H1. They looked pretty much alike to me. We'll see.

Deckard
8 January 2015, 21:50
I know I should just save up for an Aimpoint PRO but the price point on this is hard to resist, and everyone's comments isn't helping

FortTom
8 January 2015, 22:49
I know I should just save up for an Aimpoint PRO but the price point on this is hard to resist, and everyone's comments isn't helping
Well, you're kind of comparing apples to oranges, though. We're comparing micro T1's and H1's to Primary arms micro, doesn't really compare to a PRO though since they're two different animals.[:)]

Deckard
8 January 2015, 23:30
I'm just comparing price. Not size or anything else.

DutyUse
9 January 2015, 00:11
I'm just comparing price. Not size or anything else.


Depends on it's intended usage. No offense, but I'd never run a PA on something I would have to bet my life with, work, HD etc…

That said, for the price they are outstanding, and I plan on buying another Micro soon & some version of their scope for our fun guns

Deckard
9 January 2015, 00:19
I agree it's just a training gun. I never said the PA was on par with Aimpoint.

FortTom
9 January 2015, 00:51
I've got an Aimpoint of some type on all of my rifles, except 2, a 7.62 for long range and a .277 Wolverine in progress, to be used for hunting; they both wear traditional (tactical) scopes. I'm using an Aimpoint H1 on one gun, and from what I've seen with their "torture" tests, I'm not so sure that the PA isn't on par with it's similar competitor, the H1. Their specs and warranties are about the same. I'm not ready to heap it onto the "fun gun" pile yet.

Had someone told me that I would be saying this 3 months ago, I would have thought they were crazy.[:)] But this new model appears to be as tough as nails, and if you can believe PA's videos of it surviving snow, ice, rain, long drops etc., then I might not be so hesitant to use it on a SD gun. I just have yet to be able to prove it. Naytwan did a pretty good review of it, and I think that one's going to be used in UWone77's forum members T&E program. I'm not going to rip the Aimpoint RDS off of my other rifles and replace them with PA stuff, but I'm not going to turn my nose up on this new PA micro just yet, either.[:)]

FT

Deckard
9 January 2015, 07:49
Good points,

Although I wished during those torture test they'd mount it to a rifle and dropped it. I also saw a video where condensation got inside the optic but PA did have great customer service and replaced his. (just doesn't help in a HD situation) I don't own one so I guess I can't make any statements on it. I'm not turning my nose up on it exactly I'm just waiting for more reviews.

My only point in the beginning was that I wanted one. [:D]

FortTom
9 January 2015, 12:46
Deckard, I get it, you weren't debating it's reliability or anything else. I was more or less saying I want to see more proof, one way or the other.

The toughest test I've seen with it, I had actually thought of trying myself. I thought of freezing it in a Tupperware container. Then I thought better. I think the expansion ration for freezing water is about 10% or somewhere around there (correct me if I'm wrong). I thought sure as hell, if I tried that stunt, since water freezes from the outside in, I'd bust both lenses and have a zero chance of a warranty replacement. But then I saw a You Tube video, where a guy did just that. He froze it in the center of block of ice about 1.5 X the size of a brick, or so. He raised the frozen block over his head and tossed it onto cement. Then, after the main part of the frozen mass shattered, he had to chip away at the rest of the ice, to get the thing out. It still worked and functioned just fine. I would think that would be more of a torture test than dropping it attached to a gun. I really don't want to drop my guns from seven feet or more, unless it just happens, then in that case, it would just be one of those "that sucked" moments. I've seen all types of scopes fail, in one way or another, from cheap stuff, to really expensive (mine) Zeiss scopes. So, you have a good point there, about it not happening in an HD situation. That would be no fun, but I know it can happen to any scope, red dot or "traditional". That's why mine all have QD mounts and BUIS.

Obviously, I didn't witness this, but a friend of mine, who's son did two tours with the Marines in Afghanistan said that (I don't recall exactly) he either broke or witnessed a couple of ACOG's breaking, under rigorous use. Go figure.

I know you weren't debating the point, it's just that I won't discount or approve of mine for HD use based on the name on the side (unless it's really cheap stuff that you can count on breaking). I just want to see results on a wide scale basis, not based on one guy's bad experience, such as condensation build up. As an aside, I see guy's acting absolutely arrogant about not wanting anything less than a U.S. Optics or some other extravagantly expensive optic on their rifles. There rifles never touch the ground, and on the rare occasions that they see any "trigger time" , it's at the range with about 4 towels over the table top to prevent a scratch on their "pristine" guns. Yep, that really happens. Makes me debate whether I want to laugh or throw up.[:D]

But back to the point. I do want to see more and more tests, either pass or fail, before I can make a final decision for myself. I can say I've never had an Aimpoint fail on me.[:)]

Naytwan
9 January 2015, 12:49
I currently have 4 ARs. One is wearing a 1-4x scope, 2 more are wearing aimpoint pros and the last is wearing the PA Dot. I have so far put about 500 rounds threw the rifle with the PA dot. I'm not law enforcement or military, former or otherwise. I just like to shoot and fell in love with the AR platform several years ago. Granted 500 rounds is not all that much but I think its enough for me to have a good idea if the PA will do ok. I like it a lot. I cant wait to take it to a carbine class or 3 this year. I would trust it on my HD gun. The previous model, not so much. Its a nice piece but the new one is sooooo much more.

nCarnage
18 January 2015, 17:24
Interesting. Looking into this one. But since shot show is just around the corner, I want to wait and see what's coming out.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

mustangfreek
18 January 2015, 17:55
Wow...somehow i missed this review thread before, nicely done NayTwan.

I have never ran a micro yet, looked thru a PA one a few years back and the tiny tube with the big emitter instantly turned me away, and still havent had a chance to even shoot/own a micro yet, but want to try this one out, looks like a good range worthy and maybe more little red dot, and for the price, not too bad..

FortTom
18 January 2015, 18:25
Compulatapus is going to be doing a review for the WEVO T&E thread soon. Stay tuned.

DutyUse
18 January 2015, 19:18
I've got an Aimpoint of some type on all of my rifles, except 2, a 7.62 for long range and a .277 Wolverine in progress, to be used for hunting; they both wear traditional (tactical) scopes. I'm using an Aimpoint H1 on one gun, and from what I've seen with their "torture" tests, I'm not so sure that the PA isn't on par with it's similar competitor, the H1. Their specs and warranties are about the same. I'm not ready to heap it onto the "fun gun" pile yet.

Had someone told me that I would be saying this 3 months ago, I would have thought they were crazy.[:)] But this new model appears to be as tough as nails, and if you can believe PA's videos of it surviving snow, ice, rain, long drops etc., then I might not be so hesitant to use it on a SD gun. I just have yet to be able to prove it. Naytwan did a pretty good review of it, and I think that one's going to be used in UWone77's forum members T&E program. I'm not going to rip the Aimpoint RDS off of my other rifles and replace them with PA stuff, but I'm not going to turn my nose up on this new PA micro just yet, either.[:)]

FT

I wouldn't doubt it Tom. Like I said my last generation PA micro is a tank. It's only weakness is battery, which the new one seemed to fix. So whos willing to buy one and give it a proper workout? :D

FortTom
18 January 2015, 20:19
I'm looking forward to Compulotopus's review. I think it's going to be a realistic shooting test, no dumb stuff like throwing a rifle 10 feet onto concrete, etc. I think he's going to base it mostly upon the dynamics between himself as a shooter and the function of the scope. Not sure exactly what he's got in mind, but I'm guessing it's going to be a very practical test, not. a "torture test". Looking forward to see what he comes up with.

FT

Naytwan
22 January 2015, 22:37
In case anyone was curious the TangoDown Aimpoint T1 cover will fit. I may need to trim the battery pocket a little. The controls still work threw the plastic.

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7545/16345828635_4b4e8fc01c_c.jpg

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8665/16344088201_cf6da3b8c8_c.jpg