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alamo5000
20 March 2015, 20:14
I am contemplating building another upper which inevitably will evolve into an entire new rifle. In my contemplating I am thinking about a .300 BO. Keep in mind this is just one of the ideas rolling around in my head.

If I go into that caliber the main purpose for doing so will be for it's superior suppression capabilities. If I build that upper the primary purpose will be to shoot subsonics and be suppressed.

Based on my rough remembering the effective range of a .300 sub is about 200 yards or so. I also understand you need to shoot much heavier grain rounds for proper functioning.

A few questions though... what is the optimal twist rate and optimal barrel length for that kind of a set up? Please keep in mind the highest priority will be on suppression but other qualities won't be dismissed at all. Odds are also that if I get this set up the suppressor will stay on the rifle 24/7.

For the record I don't mind buying more than one suppressor. In my head one would be .30 cal for the BO and the other would be 5.56.

I am up in the air about what kind of other build I would like to do. That .277 Wolverine looks interesting. The .300 is on the short list for suppression. I am really not sure, but I would like to go either really quiet or longer range. Although I really like the whole long range thing I would constantly be begging for a place to do 1000 yard shots. Long range accuracy fits into my likes really well, but being quiet seems a whole lot more practical and it would allow me to shoot more because I won't be pissing off the neighbors with my constant blasting.

The only real restriction would be that I want to run standard BCG and use standard upper/lowers.

Putting a suppressor on my current rifle would be the easiest thing to do for my first NFA item and within the next 2-3 months I would be comfortable ponying up the dough to do just that. Barring that something changes such as job, living situation etc etc I could easily do it.

I have lots of thoughts but no real direction yet.

Ride4frnt
20 March 2015, 20:38
Blackout really shines in short barrels. My 16" runs flawlessly but if I did it again it would be a 9.5" barrel or so. I'd consider doing a double stamp if I were you and you had 400 for stamps laying around.

Dstrbdmedic167
20 March 2015, 20:51
277 wolverine! Longer range for supers and subs more than likely(still testing). You reload rights? If so I'd give it a serious look as you always do!

alamo5000
20 March 2015, 21:01
277 wolverine! Longer range for supers and subs more than likely(still testing). You reload rights? If so I'd give it a serious look as you always do!

That is one thing that has me interested in that round. But I don't know enough about exactly how far is far and what the effective range really is for supers. On paper it looks a lot better than the .300. I saw a video (I forgot who's) that showed the .277 suppressed.... and yes that looked fantastic. If I could get long range and suppression out of it then that sounds pretty good.

I saw so many people who got the .300 and sold it... I guess that all happened during the ammo shortage. But yes I reload and wouldn't have a problem reloading for whatever.



Blackout really shines in short barrels. My 16" runs flawlessly but if I did it again it would be a 9.5" barrel or so. I'd consider doing a double stamp if I were you and you had 400 for stamps laying around.

I have considered the double stamp thing but I want to really understand the whys and why nots and the reasons behind the SBR thing and why it makes it all better before I haul off and stamp things.

Dstrbdmedic167
20 March 2015, 21:03
Contact mark at MDWS and he will answer any questions you may have. Super guy and its always a plus to talk with the creator.

GaSwamper
21 March 2015, 07:33
The double is a good thing when it can be afforded. These new rounds either 300 or the Wolverine really give performance in the short barrels, anywhere from 10'' to 16'' they really hold velocities not a lot of loss going short which is great for hunters as well as door kickers. You could go pistol but nothing will truly replace a real stock and now you can suppress that 10.5'' rifle and still be under 18'' of barrel to swing. As far as the 277 WLV I just cant say enough good things about it, It has passed every test I've thrown at it and the more I use it and more I tweak it the better it is. Just yesterday I added an adjustable gas block and the Griffin suppressor comp mount and it nearly doesn't have any recoil at all now. As far as the range it is excellent with supers, mine has taken a large bodied buck at 150yds with a 10.5'' barrel one shot dead in 75yds and it wasn't an optimal kill shot. If you haven't browsed the 277 Wolverine forum I suggest you give it a look, lots of info, lots of good minds over there.

alamo5000
21 March 2015, 08:13
Ultimately for me it's not truly all about the money. I have to be judicious with what I spend and I might have to save up for it but I can get a double stamp. The real thing is the whole NFA/Stamp pain in the ass part. I don't like the idea of filling out all that bullshit forms and having records kept on all my stuff. It's just stupid that I would have to pay and wait months on end to get a harmless piece of equipment. You all know the story.

Odds are if I decide to go that route my first suppressor might be a regular 5.56 and just put it on my rifle that I have. I think that will provide me a lot of real world benefits (for my situation). I don't shoot 'as much' because we have tons of new people moving in (still very rural and safe to shoot) but I want to be considerate. Plus I am really enjoying my rifle. With all you guys help I built one that is almost perfect for my wants and needs. I spent a long time thinking it through before I bought anything and it paid off in satisfaction.

As for these other rounds go... my situation is this: I owe $65 a month for a cel phone bill. Everything else is paid off. Of course I have regular bills and stuff but I also don't have a killer high paying job. If you ask me the economy sucks still and good jobs are really thin. If I go back to making decent money I could put down a few thousand bucks and not even have a problem. But as it goes right now I am having to budget so that I don't screw myself by getting too spend happy. It's like this... I recently had to have my car worked on and admittedly it was nice to have more than enough in my bank account to pay for it all and not worry.

I do have other things that might be doing as well... one is taking a long trip overseas. I absolutely love that stuff. I am single and have the money so I like to explore. I might take off a year or two and just haul off and move somewhere for fun. I have been all over the place and I enjoy that stuff too. You only live once but when it comes to money I have to prioritize. Now throw in photography and you see that all the stuff I like to do is expensive as hell.

But over time I am hopefully going to be saving more money that I will put towards more gun stuff. Both of these .277 and .300 are viable options. But if I go that route I want something that is different in not only form but function. I have never really engaged in a lot of up close shooting. Pistols but I mean with rifles at 100 yards and in... I totally get the quiet thing but the real function of a short range rifle is something I haven't quite put enough thought into.

Truth be told though I am kind of thinking of a pig gun. In my mind prowling up on a pig to 100 yards is part of the fun for me. That's about all the shot you will get around here anyhow. Its heavily forested.

What may be an option is to get a 14.5 barrel and pin it that way if I shoot supers in either I have 200-300 yards in range no problem and if I put the suppressor on I am still not super long. I could get away with 1 stamp that way too.

I kind of don't get the bread a butter of function for SBR's. Maybe I need to learn more about SBRs in general and kind of the philosophy of use behind them. It's something to think and learn about.

Suppression is a whole different story. In my mind having a red dot or SRS with a QD magnifier and eventually a QD NV on a suppressed rifle...within say 150 yards I would have it on day or night.

alamo5000
21 March 2015, 08:36
Basically right now I am living on 25% (or less) pay vs what I earned before. I still have discretionary money but not a whole lot of it once I pay all the stuff I pay. If I don't have any big expenditures I can save about $1000 a month to put towards anything I want. But lately, every single month I have had big expenditures, car broke down, this or that, insurance bill due....

With my rifle now I am more than good at let's say 400 yards without even batting an eye. I could even go longer. I will go test out my long range capabilities before long (400, 500, 600 yards). I already have it arranged.

If I had regular access to a longer range I would probably be going that route because long range precision is just interesting to me. I get that, how it works and the ideas behind it. It's sort of ingrained in my brain and I like it. I have a .300 win mag bolt gun in the closet.

But shifting gears and trying to understand the philosophy of ANY rifle that won't shoot past 150 yards? It's something I don't have a lot of experience with. But being quiet... that part I really get. I like it. Hence the attraction.

Stone
21 March 2015, 09:08
"I am kind of thinking of a pig gun" I would go with the 6.8

Stone
21 March 2015, 09:15
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tgKjbySsAik

Dstrbdmedic167
21 March 2015, 09:17
"I am kind of thinking of a pig gun" I would go with the 6.8

A lot of 6.8 users are running a 277 WLV rifle now vs their 6.8. When you can get the same performance up to 250-300 yards and you don't have proprietary components such as bolt and mags. Like the 300 it uses standard 5.56 bolt and mags.

alamo5000
21 March 2015, 10:16
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tgKjbySsAik


That was an interesting video.

Very interesting.

One thing that he mention (that I already knew) was that .300 has become more or less standardized. For me and my uses for this type of gun, if I am shooting supers and can get out to 400 yards, I'm more than good. Effectively shooting to 300 yards would be fine but a little more reach would be better. That is my personal benchmark for a supersonic round of this nature. With a 5.56 I am more than confident that I can go well beyond that but the reality is I don't shoot that far that often.

I am also very very interested in the suppression of the gun. I could suppress a super or I could suppress a sub. It's fine. But if I really want to get the best of both worlds on that, what barrel length am I talking about for the .300?

The type of set up he had in the video is very similar to what I would be building should I go that route.

With a supersonic .300 if I go with a 8, 10, or 12 inch barrel what kind of range are we talking? Based on the video I could get out to 300 - 400 yards no problem... but I am not sure.

If I am shooting a subsonic what is my effective range out of those barrel lengths?

Lots of questions to be answered before I pony up the money.

UWone77
21 March 2015, 14:45
300 is truly a novelty round for me. What is it really doing for me personally as I don't hunt? .277 isn't in consideration for me, as I don't reload. There are more effective ways to shoot $1/round ammo. [BD]

If you're not going to shoot shorty, suppressed, I wouldn't even look at a 300 build, as those are the areas it shines.

alamo5000
21 March 2015, 15:03
300 is truly a novelty round for me. What is it really doing for me personally as I don't hunt? .277 isn't in consideration for me, as I don't reload. There are more effective ways to shoot $1/round ammo. [BD]

If you're not going to shoot shorty, suppressed, I wouldn't even look at a 300 build, as those are the areas it shines.

Shorty suppressed is the only reason I would build one. The suppression part of it being 'really really quiet' is appealing. As for the ammo I can reload that stuff no problem and bring the price point way down to maybe half or less.

I am not really sure but I might relegate my first foray (IE dipping my toe into the NFA waters) as a 5.56 suppressor for what I already have. As I said before I don't mind ultimately getting more than one suppressor if I need to. My experience with trying to make one thing do everything is that it tends to not do anything very well and eventually it breaks or wears out a lot faster than normal.

Down the road if I decide to SBR and so forth it's always an option. Financially I am completely out of any kind of debt (school included) and I plan to keep it that way for as long as possible. But I want to be wise with my money too.

Just SBR in general is a concept that I think looks pretty bad ass in all the pics but function wise I kind of struggle to see the utility of it outside of a small narrow window.

If I was in the military or a SWAT team guy I could see not having that big swing arc when going into buildings and stuff as being a major advantage. But if I am standing out in the middle of a 40 acre cow pasture that's not really an issue.

I could see SBRs including the .300 as a good urban combat type weapon. Getting in and out of cars or going inside buildings or whatever...for that application it would be good, which is a good thing to have handy.

Although you guys all have SBRs and this or that, but not even talking .300 BO, but just SBR...how are those really used in the real world outside of what I have already mentioned?

GaSwamper
21 March 2015, 18:06
The shorter and lighter the rifle the better for me when hunting. For whitetails when stalking, and when hunting in the box blinds. Big plus for hogs in the thicket as well.