M-LOK usability

[BoilerUp]

I had my first experience installing an M-LOK accessory to an M--LOK handguard. It was just the polymer pic rail section that came with my MI lightweight handguard as I might try shooting from a bipod my next time out. However, I was surprised and disappointed that it took me around 10 minutes before I got it to lock up properly on the rail. I had to fiddle with the proper "depth" of the screws to get the lugs to turn and engage fully before the screw tightened. Luckily I could see through other parts of the rail so I could inspect the back side of the screws/lugs to ensure a proper fit. I admit the M-LOK handguards generally look quite a bit nicer but Keymod has always been stupid simple to install.

Anyone else finding that you have to "fiddle" with the M-LOK attachment system to secure your accessories? The fact that the instructions from Magpul on how to attach M-LOK accessories is 5 pages suggests that maybe it's not just me

https://www.magpul.com/Admin/Public/DWSDownload.aspx?File=%2FFiles%2FFiles%2FPDF%2FPro paganda%2FM-LOK_Tips.pdf

[JGifford]

NO lie, that made my head hurt. Being as I don't change stuff around once set, I'm willing to muddle through it to have a light, strong attachment system. If I were one to change stuff up often, screw it, 1913. Keymod is too flimsy for my taste.

ETA: Nevermind...soooo much easier to watch it done than read about doing it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIWu1lNLOvI

[GOST]

You're starting to sound anti-Keymod.[:D]

[UWone77]

I've definitely got more Keymod than MLOK, but so far, I've been more satisfied with the MLOK attachments and haven't run into an issue like you described. Have you tried other MLOK accessories on the MI handguard and vice versa?

I have however, run into several KeyMod handguards that are out of spec.

[alamo5000]

The main issue that I have run into with M-lok is that magpul is not on the same page with companies using their designs. It's a nice idea but M-lok is not compatible with many very popular components. My main issue is that if you want full use of your rail you have to change out everything including your gas block. Or you have to buy an entirely new hand guard. The mixing and matching of certain components will not work.

IE M Lok will not work with Rainier Arms low profile gas blocks (or almost any other manufacturer for that matter depending on the design) and rails from SLR, Geiselle, or a number of other manufacturers. There is simply not full compatibility. I personally tried it on both and damaged one rail in the process.

I brought it up to magpul and they pass the buck.

Long story short I like Magpul but I won't buy M lok accessories from them unless I take into account how I want to use it. I've already gotten burned once on an un useable fore grip. That won't happen again.

[UWone77]

The main issue that I have run into with M-lok is that magpul is not on the same page with companies using their designs. It's a nice idea but M-lok is not compatible with many very popular components. My main issue is that if you want full use of your rail you have to change out everything including your gas block. Or you have to buy an entirely new hand guard. The mixing and matching of certain components will not work.

IE M Lok will not work with Rainier Arms low profile gas blocks (or almost any other manufacturer for that matter depending on the design) and rails from SLR, Geiselle, or a number of other manufacturers. There is simply not full compatibility. I personally tried it on both and damaged one rail in the process.

I brought it up to magpul and they pass the buck.

Long story short I like Magpul but I won't buy M lok accessories from them unless I take into account how I want to use it. I've already gotten burned once on an un useable fore grip. That won't happen again.

I felt like I just read a long luis post.

What? What do you mean mlok won't work with a Rainier Arms Gas block?

[alamo5000]

I felt like I just read a long luis post.

What? What do you mean mlok won't work with a Rainier Arms Gas block?

I don't want to sound like I am giving anyone a hard time. Not magpul or anyone else... but I am using a rainier arms low profile gas block...(see the link)

http://www.rainierarms.com/gas-block-rainier-arms-low-profile-match-grade-nitride

And if I want to use any M-Lok accessories in that same general area of where my gas block is at there isn't enough clearance between the rail and the gas block. I've tried it with two rails and no go on either. The inner diameter of the rail is too skinny and the bottom of the gas block too fat. There isn't enough clearance to make M-Lok work when using the Magpul AFG. I damaged my rail a little bit (mainly cosmetic) but long story short the AFG is a no go in that area of where I would have liked to put it.

Anywhere else on the hand guard I have had zero issues with M-Lok. Then again I don't run my rifle with a whole lot of stuff hanging on the rail. I am a bare minimum kind of guy...

[BoilerUp]

UWone77, no, I've only tried the one accessory (since it came with the rail). I think generally if the screws are set right in the accessory out of the box the M-LOK accessory should torque right on with no problems. I'm sure having done it once or twice helps, too, as I suspect I'll get them on more quickly in the future as I now better understand how the system works. I guess that's my point, though, is that with Pic rails or Keymod there isn't really any learning involved. With M-LOK, you just have to have the "depth" set right and it is no problem. It's not a big deal, it was just a bit more ficldly than I expected so I was curious to hear what others on WEVO might have to say on the subject. Frankly, I'm not a big fan of the M-LOK mechanism, but I love the look of the rails compared to the "industrial shelving" looking of KEYMOD.

To Alamo5000's point, I had to mount my pic rail section a few inches further aft than I wanted because my MI lightweight rail is super slim and just barely clears the low-pro gas block. That means there isn't room "inside" the rail for the M-LOK hardware. I can see how this can be a bit disappointing / frustrating if that forces you to compromise on where you mount your accessory (bi-pod in my case). So, the gas system on your build will dictatate where the unusable mounting positions are. In my case, I'm running mid-length gas on a 12" rail, so the gas block is close to the end, right where I want my bi-pod. If I had carbine length gas, I could probably mount the accessory exactly where I wanted. An inch either way ain't going to kill me, though. I don't blame Magpul for this, but it is something one should keep in mind when designing a layout/build. Keymod has the same issue to a lesser extent (to my Mark 1 eyeball, the M-LOK hardware protrudes a bit more inside the handguard). Clearly this is a complete non-issue for Pic rails.

One fix is to use a fat handguard with enough inside clearance. The only fat M-LOK handguard I can think of, though, is the AeroPrecision Enhance M-LOK which has a 1.8" ID. My MI handguard has 1.5" OD, so that's quite a difference!

[alamo5000]

I did the math at one point. I pulled out some calipers and measured every which way possible and without modifying the rifle or it's key components m-lok makes a section of the handguard not useable. It would be great if I could put it where I wanted it.... but its definitely a non essential part that I can easily live without. I have my rifle set up just how I like it so far.

I can't remember for sure but I think the ID of the hand guard has to be at least 1.55" or 1.6" something like that for M-lok to work without modifications being made and even then you might have to flex your barrel to get it on if you are trying to use those positions. I think 95% of all gas blocks probably won't be as slim as mine is and most rails are not made with an ID that wide so to me it's pretty much a kink in the m-lok system. I emailed magpul and the response was pretty much that everyone else is wrong so just put your AFG somewhere else on the rail...only in my case I had to move it back 5 or 6 inches from where I wanted it.

As I said though... the AFG was an experimental thing to see if I liked it. It's definitely a non essential thing.

When I did my build though I didn't know what M-lok was... LOL. I was a complete noob so I had no clue.

I ordered the keymod version of my rail but it was out of stock... so they called me and told me it would be a week or two so I just opted to get the other one based almost all the way off of appearance. [:D]

[UWone77]

Alamo, that makes more sense.

Off the top of my head, I've used the following MLOK Handguards and have had no issue with them as far as specs and lopro gas blocks interfering with the operation of the locking mechanism:

Geissele MK8
Parallax Tactical FFSSR MLOK
Mega Arms MML
Magpul MOE SL

[alamo5000]

I think on your MK8 if you look straight down the barrel of the gun you can see it shaped a little different. At the 12:00, 3:00, 6:00, and 9:00 your rail is kind of protruded a bit which might be the difference. I don't know... I'm not an expert by any means.

As I said though I originally ordered a keymod rail but they were out of stock so they called me back up and gave me my options... so I bought the m-lok one instead so I didn't have to wait. It was based sheerly on looks [:D] ...

Yeah, I know. I was being a noob... but anyway it is what it is so I am not losing sleep over it.

[Slippers]

Interesting that you mention the gas block clearance. Magpul specifies a min/max length for the screw to protrude past the backside of the M-Lok accessory, and we aim to be right in the middle of the range when we draw the part up. Even with that, some narrow handguards will allow the screw to protrude too far on the inside, and hit the gas block. Even the Geissele MK8 has this issue if you're using the 1:30 or 10:30 mounting surfaces, depending on the components you have. For instance, my 14.5 with BCM gas block has only about 15-20 thousandths clearance with the screws on our inline mounts on my MK8, which is a little close for comfort.

On something like the Erathr3 rail, which is basically a Noveske NSR, it will be very difficult to put an M-Lok accessory right below the gas block. The screws will hit the block.