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alamo5000
17 October 2015, 20:33
I skipped town and went to get my silencer today. I was planning to go on Monday but I had to get mine before Former11B got his ;)

This is my very first suppressor so I will share here "first thoughts" and post back time to time with updates. Hopefully this can help others who may be agonizing over how to spend their money :) On a serious note it does seem like a big commitment jumping into the NFA game so the more info the better is my motto.

On a side note my laptop is officially dead so no pictures for the time being.

I bought the Recce 5 after basically a ton of research on the internet. Up until today I had never seen a Griffin anything in person, much less the Recce 5. I do have to give credit where credit is due though. WEVO has been a damn gold mine for information and reliable opinions. I've wanted a silencer forever but joining here kicked me over the edge.

The Recce 5 seems extremely well built. Yet it is not too heavy. It is shorter than a 30 round magazine and by the time you thread it on its really not adding a whole lot of length to the rifle.

I was at a gun shop about a month ago and they had a silencer mounted on an AR so I picked it up. The thing was super nose heavy. With the Recce 5 though my first impression is totally different. On my rifle it seems extremely well balanced. It seems as though it was meant to be there. It is slightly more nose heavy but NOTHING like the other one I picked up. That just might be the luck of the draw on my rifle, but it works for me. Overall my initial feel was very positive.

The suppressor came with the minimalist taper mount muzzle brake. Initially when I bought my silencer it was the MOD2 and I picked it partially because of the mount. Probably half the reason for choosing Griffin was because of the mount. It wasn't until I was in a couple of months before I even knew I was getting a MOD3. In the end I am not really a brake guy so I will probably end up getting a flash comp mount but the little one does seem alright. I imagine if I end up shooting 95% of the time suppressed I guess it won't matter. After I put the little one on the gun it doesn't look that bad.

The little carrying case for the silencer is camo. I would prefer black but that's just me. None the less that is a non essential part.

I put the mount on the gun using the shim set. It does require timing to some degree. I had to fiddle with it some.

My research I feel did pay off. I think the mounting system is really good and really solid. There is zero wobble. That thing locks up tight. That said if I were doing it again I would not rule out Griffin's QD mount. The taper mount is rock solid and leaves little to complain about and very little room for things to break. At least I hope so. That said putting the can off and on you have to take your time to align it right. I don't know if its worth worrying about but if the thing somehow got cross threaded that could be a big pain in the ass. I also don't know if the can could ever work itself loose. I don't think it would and the odds of it happening are low but who knows. Once I shoot it with the can on maybe that will teach me some more about it.

The stand out thing for me during the first 15 minutes is the handling of it on the gun. The balance and weight and all that are just awesome, at least that's my initial impression. We will see how all this evolves over time.

Dstrbdmedic167
17 October 2015, 20:57
Great first thoughts. Proof is in the pudding... Shoot it!!!

alamo5000
17 October 2015, 21:27
It was dark by the time a meandered home so I have to wait until tomorrow.

din
17 October 2015, 22:14
It was dark by the time a meandered home so I have to wait until tomorrow.

If it works how it's supposed to, just go out in your backyard...

alamo5000
18 October 2015, 15:18
I walked out in the back yard and set up to shoot my 100 yard plate. I only took a few shots but holy smokes. That thing is NIIICE! Let the new crack habit begin!

I did the first shot with ear plugs but after that, they were not needed with this can and especially for my little test. It was not uncomfortable at all to shoot with no plugs or muffs. I had other people back a little bit listening and they said it sounded like the air rushing out of a tire after it was punctured. Just a quick "PSheew" and that's it. It was nice as hell!

It's definitely doing the job it was hired for.

I did not experience any blow back in my face. Nothing. In that regard it was like I was shooting normally. I had nothing splashing me in the face although I will obviously test this more. I did notice carbon all over my magazine.

It did seem like there was less recoil not that it's a big deal with .223 but it seemed less. Again I will test this more.

I did notice what was known as POI shift. I will do more testing on that but it seems like it was hitting low and slightly left from normal. I will report back with more numbers later.

I did come back and adjust my gas block some just as an experiment. I will let you know more later.

The overall first impression was somewhere between joyus a d frickin awesome.

gatordev
18 October 2015, 16:18
I did the first shot with ear plugs but after that, they were not needed with this can and especially for my little test. It was not uncomfortable at all to shoot with no plugs or muffs.

Just be careful. While it might not hurt during a one-time exposure, it can add up. It's not as much the gunshot that causes the issue with 5.56, it's the supersonic crack of the bullet.

alamo5000
18 October 2015, 16:53
Just be careful. While it might not hurt during a one-time exposure, it can add up. It's not as much the gunshot that causes the issue with 5.56, it's the supersonic crack of the bullet.

Yes for sure. If I was just needing or wanting to shoot a few rounds it is hearing safe...that is my main observation. If I was going to shoot a lot I still think I would wear ear plugs. After a magazine of shooting it can give a headache.

As for my POI shift I got my sled and adjusted my optic 3 MOA down and 1 MOA left.

On my gas block I tried turning it down and up to see about the blow back. My regular setting was 7. On 9 it was ejecting brass 90 degrees out the side of the gun and some of the brass was dinged up. On setting 8 it worked flawlessly and the brass was flawless. I tried turning it down a lot more to simulate a standard block and the gun still ran fine although it was pitching the crap out of the brass at a much more steep angle. Like I said, based on just a few rounds setting 8 seemed to work best by my initial tests.

alamo5000
18 October 2015, 17:00
Just be careful. While it might not hurt during a one-time exposure, it can add up. It's not as much the gunshot that causes the issue with 5.56, it's the supersonic crack of the bullet.

That is a good observation that I've heard before. Mainly here on WEVO. That does go very well with the intent of my thread. I'm a suppressor noob so hopefully as I walk through this as I go when some other noob wonders the same stuff they can read this and find answers.

After a magazine of shooting you might have a behind the eyeballs headache so just to be safe still plan on muffs or ear plugs.

DutyUse
19 October 2015, 02:08
Congrats bro, glad your liking it

JGifford
19 October 2015, 03:24
It's not safe, and you need to wear earpro.

*end medical PSA*

toolboxluis00200
19 October 2015, 09:22
It's not safe, and you need to wear earpro.

*end medical PSA*

Que???

Slippers
19 October 2015, 09:34
Que???

Normal .223/5.56 shot suppressed is not hearing safe for the shooter. It may be tolerable, but you're still damaging your hearing. Observers 5-10 yards behind you should be fine without hearing protection, though.

I highly recommend a set of surefire ep3 plugs with the ports left open for suppressed use. You can hear everyone talk, they don't take batteries, and don't squash your ears. Plus, they're cheap. :)

toolboxluis00200
19 October 2015, 09:38
Normal .223/5.56 shot suppressed is not hearing safe for the shooter. It may be tolerable, but you're still damaging your hearing. Observers 5-10 yards behind you should be fine without hearing protection, though.

I highly recommend a set of surefire ep3 plugs with the ports left open for suppressed use. You can hear everyone talk, they don't take batteries, and don't squash your ears. Plus, they're cheap. :)

It was a joke lol

alamo5000
19 October 2015, 09:49
Normal .223/5.56 shot suppressed is not hearing safe for the shooter. It may be tolerable, but you're still damaging your hearing. Observers 5-10 yards behind you should be fine without hearing protection, though.

I highly recommend a set of surefire ep3 plugs with the ports left open for suppressed use. You can hear everyone talk, they don't take batteries, and don't squash your ears. Plus, they're cheap. :)

Got a link? I might pick a pair up.

I just use hunter orange foam plugs. If it gets really bad aka like at the monster truck rally I throw a pair of bionic muffs on top of that.

My big bionic muffs are actually a little too big. Sometimes when I get down in prone position my muffs were too wide.

alamo5000
19 October 2015, 09:50
It was a joke lol

Don't worry... I got the joke LOL!

GOST
19 October 2015, 10:43
I highly recommend a set of surefire ep3 plugs with the ports left open for suppressed use. You can hear everyone talk, they don't take batteries, and don't squash your ears. Plus, they're cheap. :)


Got a link? I might pick a pair up.


http://www.amazon.com/Surefire-EP3-Sonic-Defender-Protection/dp/B003CGKDHE

Slippers
19 October 2015, 10:45
Got a link? I might pick a pair up.

I just use hunter orange foam plugs. If it gets really bad aka like at the monster truck rally I throw a pair of bionic muffs on top of that.

My big bionic muffs are actually a little too big. Sometimes when I get down in prone position my muffs were too wide.

http://www.surefire.com/ep3-sonic-defenders.html

They have enough reduction for outdoor use for sporting clays, skeet, or hunting. Not enough for unsuppressed centerfire rifle though.

toolboxluis00200
19 October 2015, 12:50
Don't worry... I got the joke LOL!

Lol list u got it

Slippers
19 October 2015, 13:12
Lol list u got it

Yeah I fail.

Farva
19 October 2015, 14:08
What gas block are you using?

toolboxluis00200
19 October 2015, 14:11
Yeah I fail.

Just send meva few hand stops and will forgive u [BD][BD][BD]

alamo5000
19 October 2015, 14:18
What gas block are you using?

SLR Adjustable set screw type. One extra click and it seems to be in the zone.

Farva
19 October 2015, 14:19
SLR Adjustable set screw type. One extra click and it seems to be in the zone.

Very nice. I was thinking of trying one of those out

alamo5000
19 October 2015, 14:27
The next time I shoot I will try my other charging handle. I've shot a few times already, a mag here and a mag there and so far I've gotten exactly zero gas in my face. I don't know if the gas in the face thing is supposed to happen when you do heavy fire or what.

I'm not sure the dynamics of it. I'm shooting on a 16" barrel. I don't really do heavy fire with this set up. I'm not sure if the snach handle is working or not, or if the silencer is just that awesome to start with. Other than just the noise difference there isn't much different in regards to having anything blow back in my face.

alamo5000
19 October 2015, 14:30
Very nice. I was thinking of trying one of those out

I really like mine. I have an extra long tool so I can adjust mine on the go even with the can on. The only downside is that long tool doesn't fit in any of the pouches on my rifle bag. It's too long. Other than that I have no complaints.

GRIFFIN ARMAMENT
19 October 2015, 18:34
The Minimalist Brake that we are now shipping with Recce 5 mod3's is a great muzzle device. Its short, controls muzzle rise, reduces recoil, and offers a sacrificial baffle to the suppressor for increased durable service life.

Its also only 1.8 ounces meaning that the Recce 5 and brake as a system is only 16.3 ounces. Ridiculously light given the flagship cans this competes with in sound performance. Its also fully constructed of billet 17-4 so it's tough as nails as well.

http://www.griffinarmament.com/Griffin-Taper-Mount-Minimalist-Brake-p/tmm.htm

Im glad you are liking the Recce5 have fun with it. Its unbeatable in the current market.

As for cross threading concerns. I've used taper mounts more than anyone. Between trade shows, dealer demos, testing, and having fun on my own ive probably attached and detached the taper mount a couple thousand times and have never cross threaded it. Its classified as a fine thread but its very large and is pretty durable. We have yet to damage one in house.

alamo5000
19 October 2015, 18:54
The Minimalist Brake that we are now shipping with Recce 5 mod3's is a great muzzle device. Its short, controls muzzle rise, reduces recoil, and offers a sacrificial baffle to the suppressor for increased durable service life.

Its also only 1.8 ounces meaning that the Recce 5 and brake as a system is only 16.3 ounces. Ridiculously light given the flagship cans this competes with in sound performance. Its also fully constructed of billet 17-4 so it's tough as nails as well.

http://www.griffinarmament.com/Griffin-Taper-Mount-Minimalist-Brake-p/tmm.htm

Im glad you are liking the Recce5 have fun with it. Its unbeatable in the current market.

As for cross threading concerns. I've used taper mounts more than anyone. Between trade shows, dealer demos, testing, and having fun on my own ive probably attached and detached the taper mount a couple thousand times and have never cross threaded it. Its classified as a fine thread but its very large and is pretty durable. We have yet to damage one in house.

Without question I honestly think I made the right choice. I bought it sight unseen based on the internet and some excellent advice from here at WEVO. For people on a budget sometimes that can be pretty daunting to drop nearly a grand on an unfamiliar six month process and on a product you've never seen...

As for the brake it definitely does its job. It's built great. At first having never owned and very minimally used any silencer though it was something I paid a lot of attention to. How the thing attaches to the gun was more than half of the reason for my choice and overall I am very pleased with everything.

alamo5000
19 October 2015, 19:03
All that said though I've never tried shooting with just the brake and no suppressor, at least not the Griffin one. If I personally was going to shoot unsupressed more I might invest in the flash comp. Whether or not I'm going to be doing that is still up in the air. I will probably shoot suppressed most of the time from now on so I guess it's a moot point.

Former11B
20 October 2015, 08:15
Here's mine. The mount is curing on the rifle (blue loctite with shims. It comes with 5 .002" shims and 4 .010" shims for timing FYI)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/DownSouthTAS/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsfgrfpnwk.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/DownSouthTAS/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsdbiu07t4.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/DownSouthTAS/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpstuw15btt.jpg

I tried taking some pictures comparing it to my 5.56 Innovative Arms Grunt but they were all over exposed. This is the best one and it still sucks

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/DownSouthTAS/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsl7aws039.jpg


The Recce is a little more slim than the 1.5" diameter IA can and a few ounces lighter. Can't wait to compare them side by side as far as sound and performance goes.

As far as concerns about it backing off the taper mount...if anything you should be concerned about it locking up lol. I have another taper mount can that's gotten stuck. I'm going to put a tiny bit of anti sieze or similar JUST on the taper itself.

Slippers
20 October 2015, 09:45
Blue loctite eh?

Can looks very nice.

Former11B
20 October 2015, 10:33
What's the issue with blue loctite?

BC98
20 October 2015, 12:13
It has a relatively low loosening temperature. I believe red loctite is around 550 degrees F, blue is 300. A suppressor can easily reach 700 degrees, breaking down the threadlocker and allowing your muzzle device to potentially come off with your can. For comparison, I believe Rocksett is good up to 1100 degrees(?).

alamo5000
20 October 2015, 12:38
I didn't put any stuff on my muzzle brake. What is the consensus about doing so?

Former11B
20 October 2015, 12:50
I've used blue loctite before. The breakdown temperature hasn't really been an issue...I've found once it cures, even if it breaks loose, it provides a substantial amount of friction between the threads, sort of like putting teflon tape on the threads to prevent a direct thread can from backing off. It's on a 16" barrel, not shooting full auto, and as the can is aptly named, the rifle is set up as sort of a "Recce" rifle. It's my go-to, most frequently shot rifle, but I'm not lighting cigarettes off the can like some of my guys used to do off my SAW barrel.

I do have red loctite, so if it's ever an issue, I'll just clean the threads off and re-apply. Thanks for the help

Former11B
20 October 2015, 13:06
I didn't put any stuff on my muzzle brake. What is the consensus about doing so?

I highly recommend it on a suppressor mount of any kind.

If you shoot a lot through your can and don't have time to take it off before the can cools, it may lock up to the taper mount and when you go to unscrew it, there's a good chance you'll unscrew the mount from the barrel with it stuck in the can...I've had that happen before. Basically, I just tightened it back on as hard as I could and dumped a couple mags through it. After I could touch it, but while it was still hot (using nomex gloves), I was able to remove the can. I then loctite'd the muzzle device on. This can also prevent a slow loosening/backing off of the mount over time.

Experience has also taught me to apply a small dab of anti-sieze or Frog Lube on the taper mount (not threads) for ease of removal after shooting

Slippers
20 October 2015, 13:34
You should really use a drop of rocksett. It holds until 2000 degrees. It's also easy to remove when you want to remove it. I definitely would not use red loctite. Even after you apply heat, red loctite is a pain in the butt. It's labeled as "permanent" for a reason.

And yes, nickel anti-seize makes a huge difference. It's the only way I can keep my Saker from carbon-welding every time I use it.

alamo5000
20 October 2015, 14:12
OK so where do I get rocksett? I'm willing to give it a go.

SwissyJim
20 October 2015, 14:46
I got my Rocksett at Brownell's

Slippers
20 October 2015, 15:49
Yeah, Brownell's is where I got mine, too. And go easy with it. One drop is all you need if the threads are clean.

Former11B
20 October 2015, 22:40
For some reason my iPhone camera has been taking pictures that are really fuzzy/hazy looking.

Guess I'll have to switch to my wife's DSLR

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/DownSouthTAS/NewRecce_zpsm13lk9mm.jpg

Joelski
21 October 2015, 03:47
That's a beauty.

GRIFFIN ARMAMENT
22 October 2015, 12:38
We would recommend torque. 35ftlbs 1/228 45 for 5/824

Red loctite over rocksett if a secondary mech is desired. Weve used rockcett at a point and just saw inconsistent performance. Sometimes no threadlocking sometimes immovable stuck on barrels when customers wanted a muzzle device replaced.

alamo5000
13 February 2016, 10:41
Update:

My suppressor is still frickin' awesome. I would recommend it to anyone in the market. That said I learned a little something today through my own duhh screw up.

I recently found a video from GA that I had never seen before and I had a complete duhhh moment.

In my haste back when I got my suppressor I did not install my muzzle device correctly. I completely James'ed the thing! (which is pretty easy to do actually)

https://s3.amazonaws.com/coppercustom_website/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/02151729/TMM-3.jpg

If you can't tell from the picture the device has one side of it that is fatter than the other side of it. IE the top has more cut out grooves in the brake chamber than the bottom of it does. The fatter side has the GA logo on it --so naturally I just put the thing on not really knowing or paying attention to the difference.

When I watched a relatively new GA youtube video... Basically I got my suppressor in the first batch that was using the mini brake and there wasn't much information out there yet... but still....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=US1ztx9RK1o

The gun worked fine and the accuracy while suppressed was not effected at all in either orientation, but one thing that DID change was my POI shift. I had to rezero my rifle and by the time it was all said and done I had to adjust my scope around a couple of MOA.

After doing it the correct way and looking back and my previous POI shift... now I figure my suppressed vs unsuppressed equates to approximately 1 MOA POI shift directly down. I will have to confirm that but that is about right. So while it didn't have any impact on my paper punching once zeroed and always shooting suppressed... but the orientation of the muzzle device did have a pretty significant impact on the initial shift.

Even though I am opening myself up for lots of jokes at my expense it was an honest mistake, but a learning experience. It also goes to show that at least my suppressor is pretty precision machined with apparently a lot of engineering put into it...but also that repeatability matters. I would go so far as to say that the orientation of my (or any other suppressor) makes a great deal of difference. In other words mounting options make a big difference. So when buying a suppressor take that into account.

alamo5000
13 February 2016, 10:50
Before you make fun of me too much though it's important to note that the orientation of the muzzle device was the first thing he went over in the FAQ [:D]

Apparently I wasn't the only one that muffed that up.

Josh S.
14 February 2016, 10:02
Regarding Rocksett, make sure you clean the threads well and put a SMALL amount. I've heard one or two drops is all you need. A few months ago I bought a Surefire Socom brake for my .308 at the LGS and had them install it while I was there. I ended up parting out the gun and when I tried removing the brake it wouldn't budge. Turns out the gunsmith used more than half the tube of Rocksett and they had to soak it in oil for 3 days to break down the Rocksett and then tried to charge me another $20 to fix their own mistake. I took my gun, gave them a description of my truck and where I was headed, and told them if they wanted their $20 that badly they could report me to the police. I haven't been that pissed off in a LONG time and my friends and family are boycotting that shop due to more issues than just this one.

Former11B
15 February 2016, 16:34
Guess you didn't see the pics I posted here of install:


http://www.weaponevolution.com/forum/showthread.php?1031-NFA-Picture-Thread/page69

alamo5000
15 February 2016, 16:37
Guess you didn't see the pics I posted here of install:


http://www.weaponevolution.com/forum/showthread.php?1031-NFA-Picture-Thread/page69

I did not! :) There is a lot of action on the forum here and sometimes things fall through the cracks. Now though some of your shots are not there...

alamo5000
15 February 2016, 16:41
On a side note I would think you would have to shoot an obscene amount of ammo to be able to wear out that muzzle brake :) Even if it is a sacrificial blast baffle it seems to me it would take years to wear that out.

That brings up another question... I wonder if you can wear out a suppressor? Assuming the mount stays OK... I wonder how much you have to shoot to wear it out? Assuming you don't do full auto mag dumps all the time... just regular shooting... I would guess the round count would be pretty high.

Former11B
15 February 2016, 17:40
On a side note I would think you would have to shoot an obscene amount of ammo to be able to wear out that muzzle brake :) Even if it is a sacrificial blast baffle it seems to me it would take years to wear that out.

That brings up another question... I wonder if you can wear out a suppressor? Assuming the mount stays OK... I wonder how much you have to shoot to wear it out? Assuming you don't do full auto mag dumps all the time... just regular shooting... I would guess the round count would be pretty high.


If you shot only on a 10.5" rifle, you'd see a pretty deep erosion in the brake after 5-6k rounds.



See erosion timeline by WI57 about 1/3 way down

https://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=6&f=20&t=380898

These pics show that the shape of the blast baffle is crucial for longevity and also how thin the AAC end caps are. Otherwise that M42K was taking a beating on F/A


And yes, you CAN wear out a...can, but you'd likely wear out a few barrels in the process (assuming no premature catastrophic failure due to wobbly mount or other non-ideal condition)

alamo5000
15 February 2016, 18:38
If you shot only on a 10.5" rifle, you'd see a pretty deep erosion in the brake after 5-6k rounds.



See erosion timeline by WI57 about 1/3 way down

https://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=6&f=20&t=380898

These pics show that the shape of the blast baffle is crucial for longevity and also how thin the AAC end caps are. Otherwise that M42K was taking a beating on F/A


And yes, you CAN wear out a...can, but you'd likely wear out a few barrels in the process (assuming no premature catastrophic failure due to wobbly mount or other non-ideal condition)

DAMN! Those pics of that guy's brake were crazy! Based on his can and that he burned the finish off of it it seems like he shoots a whole lot harder than I do. That said that is a very eye opening thing right there.

Thanks for sharing that. WEVO never disappoints... I am always learning stuff around here.