Tactical Hog Control

[Joelski]

Any of you Texas boys ever heard of this place? My Cousin and I are planning an Oct. '17 trip down just for this hunt. He's in WA and I'm in Ohio. It'll be his boy's first hunt and we're all stoked to do this. Their schrick is NV/Thermal hog hunting. Cousin is a prior service SF guy and works on for the Port Authority, so I'm planning to learn as much from him as I can, so it's more like a hunt and a class for the price of one event. If anybody has had experience with this outfit, or knows anybody who has hunted with them, please post up your thoughts. It's not cheap to do, but they supply all the NV gear, plus AR's and ammo. Meat can be taken, but I don't think either of us are interested in paying freight on something we can buy cheaper back home. I hope there's some good feedback; this is gonna be cool!

http://www.tacticalhogcontrol.com/landownerwhythc.htm

[alamo5000]

Based on their website they are right here where I live. As in literally in the middle of where I'm at. I am pretty sure I've talked to that guy before, in fact I know I have. He's a Silencer Shop partner/FFL. If I'm not mistaken he owns his own machine shop as well and has a line of suppressors that he makes.

Their HQ where the guy lives (per the website) is maybe 30 minutes away, which by Texas standards is really close.

Let me know what you want to know and I will give you all kinds of info if I can.

I've never hunted with them but I will try to find out more if you want.

The guy also owns this outfit by the way.

http://www.cottonwoodarmory.com/

[Joelski]

I'd be interested in hearing anything you observe and if you know anybody who's hunted with him, if you could get their feelings about the operation, that would be great. It's definitely not a cheap thing to do, so I'd like to know if people think its worth it. My heartburn so far is rainout cancellation (Not that Texas in October is necessarily monsoon season, but I am that guy when it comes to shitty luck). If they cancel because of inclement weather, which I get it that its expensive gear and they don't want to subject it to undue damage, however, they don't refund, they reschedule, which for my cousin and I, isn't a cheap thing to reschedule flights to texas at a later date. So far, thats the only real risk I see, other than a sharp decline in hogs by the time we get there. [:D]

[alamo5000]

I'd be interested in hearing anything you observe and if you know anybody who's hunted with him, if you could get their feelings about the operation, that would be great. It's definitely not a cheap thing to do, so I'd like to know if people think its worth it. My heartburn so far is rainout cancellation (Not that Texas in October is necessarily monsoon season, but I am that guy when it comes to shitty luck). If they cancel because of inclement weather, which I get it that its expensive gear and they don't want to subject it to undue damage, however, they don't refund, they reschedule, which for my cousin and I, isn't a cheap thing to reschedule flights to texas at a later date. So far, thats the only real risk I see, other than a sharp decline in hogs by the time we get there. [:D]

Stay in touch and don't be shy to inbox me. I am working a lot these days so it might take me some time to find out much or go over and meet the guy in person.

Just living here though it's up to you if you want to pay that to go hunt. That's what it boils down to. It has it's benefits for sure.

That guy some of his hunts are within just a few miles of my house so you could say I do live in 'hog heaven' [BD]

Here is my initial reactions...

Getting 'on the hogs' is a big deal. It actually takes a lot of work and you have to know people that have the land. You have to have a place big enough and in the right areas. High terrain won't have hogs, low terrain will be overrun. This guy probably has 7 or 8 or more locations around that he's constantly monitoring. So from the sounds of it he's a guy that knows where the action is at. There is obviously never a guarantee but that is a big deal for someone who is coming from out of town.

Also to be familiar with the terrain specifically where you're hunting is another big deal. Some folks about 5-10 minutes or so from my home have an 850 acre ranch that I went out to a lot (and will go some more after deer season) and it's taken me a long ass time to get to know the trails and turf there. I can only imagine doing that on 9 or 10 places.

If it was me and you were coming all the way down here I would plan to stay around about a week and try to get one or two good hunts in during that time. The weather is a big deal as you noted. Here it's not like other places when people think of rain. I've seen it rain 18 inches or more in a day. When it rains here it RAINS. There is no way you're going to want to be out in that (or even after that). If you're knee deep in mud and mosquitoes you're going to be hating life. It will also seriously limit the territory you can get to even with motorized means, not to mention trying to do that at night.

These guys look like they tend to stalk the pigs. They aren't flying in on them or whatever. It all just depends on what kind of hunting you want to do.

[Josh S.]

I can attest to the rain here in Texas. I've hog and turkey hunted in almost knee deep water more times than I care to count and it's never fun. However...if they get a very light rain a day or two before y'all come down then that would be perfect since the ground will be soft and the hogs will be out in full force rooting up every piece of dirt they can.

If you haven't booked the hunt yet I would give Reel Rush Charters a call. They're located in Bay City right off Matagorda Bay and offer everything from hog hunts to alligator hunts to offshore fishing trips. My cousin knows the family personally so I can find out pretty much anything you want to know. I'm pretty sure they offer helicopter hunts as well if that's something y'all would be interested in.

[UWone77]

Hog Shoot from a helicopter with NV is still on my bucket list. Texas at some point!

[SINNER]

Did some NV coyote hunting in Texas with low level gear. Wound up being easier to light up their eyes with a green laser and shoot them in the foreheads. From a helo with NV would not be easy but about as much fun as I can think of. Pilot better be the man.

[Josh S.]

Hog Shoot from a helicopter with NV is still on my bucket list. Texas at some point!

I can't say I know anyone that does NV heli-hog hunts but if you're ever in the market for a daytime hunt let me know and I can point you in the right direction.

[alamo5000]

Hog Shoot from a helicopter with NV is still on my bucket list. Texas at some point!

I don't think it's legal to do here. I am pretty sure the heli hunting thing is from dusk to dusk. After dark they can spot from the air but not shoot.

I could be wrong but I think the dusk rule is in effect.

[Josh S.]

Just looked it up and Alamo is correct, no nighttime hog hunting from a helicopter.

I read the FAQ's for a couple different outfits and one of them said they usually kill 15-25 hogs in a two hour flight. Personally, I would stay away from an operation like that. When guys flew on our old lease they usually killed 100-150 in a 3-4 hour flight. 15-25 hogs in 2 hrs is very low in my opinion. The other one said they recommend any semi-auto rifle and strongly advise against using shotguns, which I disagree with. AR's work fine but a 12 gauge with buckshot is optimal.

[alamo5000]

Just looked it up and Alamo is correct, no nighttime hog hunting from a helicopter.

I read the FAQ's for a couple different outfits and one of them said they usually kill 15-25 hogs in a two hour flight. Personally, I would stay away from an operation like that. When guys flew on our old lease they usually killed 100-150 in a 3-4 hour flight. 15-25 hogs in 2 hrs is very low in my opinion. The other one said they recommend any semi-auto rifle and strongly advise against using shotguns, which I disagree with. AR's work fine but a 12 gauge with buckshot is optimal.

I think it depends largely on terrain as to the appropriate firearm. Up where I'm at there are a lot of big operations. Heli-bacon is like 30 min from my house. There are a ton of them.

Around here the vegetation is thick and the trees kind of tall so the helicopters have to maintain a higher altitude. In other areas of the state where it's more wide open and there is smaller types of vegetation they can fly in lower or whatnot. Buckshot at 100 yards? Is it effective? Possibly, but a rifle is better IMO.

As far as numbers go I think that's a hit or miss thing. Some of it is pure luck, but other parts of it is dependent on a lot of things. Around where I am the pigs have a substantial amount of cover so the window of operation (IE pig blasting) is pretty short. The pigs will be there but if they scatter 15 different directions and run under a canopy of trees...

Even an hour north of me it's a lot easier to catch them in the open.

[alamo5000]

a 12 gauge with buckshot is optimal.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F42Bsc8YtnU

Fast forward to 9:20 and see the results at 100yards with buckshot.

[SINNER]

3.5" Tri-balls only work out to about 50 yds. Buckshot is even worse. Shotguns are only useful for running hogs with dogs. Even then I'd rather have a .308.

[Josh S.]

That's about what I would expect from buckshot at 100 yds. Don't get me wrong, I see what you're saying about shotguns not being as effective in certain areas where there is lots of cover. No argument here. If the terrain permits though, and you have a pilot that knows what they're doing and is willing to fly low, then a 12 gauge is the way to go in my opinion.

[Joelski]

The whole idea is tactical rifles and night vision. It's a goal of mine to have my own gear to hunt on my own property, but I won't have enough for other people.

This place is appealing because we don't have to fart with hauling our own shooting gear around.

[alamo5000]

The whole idea is tactical rifles and night vision. It's a goal of mine to have my own gear to hunt on my own property, but I won't have enough for other people.

This place is appealing because we don't have to fart with hauling our own shooting gear around.

Hauling gear around is the least of the problem. That's the easy part. Having access to land that has hogs on it is a big deal, and in Texas 90%+ of that land is privately owned. Having the ins with someone that can get you there is a big deal. The second biggest deal is even if you are on the land and have access the pigs don't just come wondering up to where you are at. There is a substantial amount of work and skill involved to hunt hogs. This is particularly true when ground hunting.

When you pay for a hunt of this nature you're paying for local connections and expertise. Even thing such as weather can dictate hunting in location B instead of location A or whatever. If you want to come on down I can get you on some property for free but getting on the hogs is a different story. Night vision or not the skills (and location) to get you to the piggies are applicable no matter what.

Basically if you have limited time a guided hunt is hands down the way to go. When picking a guide I would recommend asking the right questions of your potential guide is the real key. I would say around here if you come back with 5 or 6 hogs a night (each) for a on the ground hunt and you will be doing ok. Anything more than that is icing on the cake.

If it was me I would call and ask the guide about the stuff I mentioned above. That and the weather for the time of year you are coming. If he seems like a nice guy or someone you can get along well with then that's a big deal (to me). My advice would be to try and flesh out his skill set. See what resources he has (not just equipment).

[gatordev]

I know it's getting off-topic, but I'm curious what happens to the ballistics of buckshot out of a helo. Since it's round and there's no twist, seems like it would, technically, have less going on than a traditional round. Then again, it's not going very fast for very long, so it makes me wonder if it just starts following chaos theory.

Also, I know I sound like a broken record, but those of you who want to hunt at night from a helo don't realize how sketch that can be. Even more so in something like a R44.

[alamo5000]

I know it's getting off-topic, but I'm curious what happens to the ballistics of buckshot out of a helo. Since it's round and there's no twist, seems like it would, technically, have less going on than a traditional round. Then again, it's not going very fast for very long, so it makes me wonder if it just starts following chaos theory.

Also, I know I sound like a broken record, but those of you who want to hunt at night from a helo don't realize how sketch that can be. Even more so in something like a R44.

I have no idea about the buckshot or if the prop wash would effect it or not. I imagine it probably wouldn't have a substantial effect on it merely because in a relatively short time it would be out of the brunt of the wash. Too bad we have no way to test it LOL!

As for the helo flight at night... you're a pilot gator... tell us what it's like getting low like that? LOL Especially when you have trees and such around...I would think it would be pretty scary.

As far as I understand it Texas can do these heli hunts AT ALL because of a technicality. Federal law bans hunting from the air as does state law. The 'exception' they are using is that 'hog hunting' isn't considered 'sport hunting'. It's considered resource management. It's basically on paper a big eradication program of a non native species.

Regardless of the label you still get to dust piglets from the air but there are still some restrictions on it. If you were to ever shoot pretty much anything other than a pig from the air you would wish you hadn't. That's a no play time zone right there.

[Joelski]

This is not a helo hunt unless we do daylight hunting too and then God help my visa card. Gator: why don't you come haul us all around? UW can do some NV night shooting and me and cuz can fast rope into the hunt area during the day? [:D]

We are looking at this outfit since there aren't many advertising or I just don't know the places to look and the Google machine isn't cooperating. I am not bringing hogs anywhere, so the cleanup is up to the guide and it sounds like they dispose of them as they seem to be making money off both landowners and hunters.

[alamo5000]

You are correct. They make money from all ends. I think the guy you picked out is alright. Just call and talk to him. He has all the right stuff so give it a go. If you want to hunt other stuff like exotic things I can possibly hook you up. You can do two different types of hunts in a couple of days around here.

[Joelski]

What is the license fee? I think the 5 day pass was the way we are leaning. $600 for a six hour hunt.... I'm having a hard time with that! There should be hookers and blow for that kinda cake! [:D]

Call me inexperienced at hunting trips because my county is a destination for white tail. I've been to Canada for Elk and had to pack it out, which was sort of okay. The Elk I got was just odd. You could eat half a steak with a spoon, and the other side of the bone required a sawzall!

This was on my bestie's trail cam the other day. He's going down!

https://scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/15027930_10208345936990401_6906306656268130179_n.j pg?oh=868c3c5bc8fa74177b4529e8e54fcb4a&oe=58B503FE

[gatordev]

I have no idea about the buckshot or if the prop wash would effect it or not. I imagine it probably wouldn't have a substantial effect on it merely because in a relatively short time it would be out of the brunt of the wash. Too bad we have no way to test it LOL!

Duration in the wash isn't the issue. Super sonic rounds still get affected by velocity and wash, but their construct is part of the reason for that. Even so, the differences between where you're shooting from (in the aircraft) still makes my head hurt.


As for the helo flight at night... you're a pilot gator... tell us what it's like getting low like that? LOL Especially when you have trees and such around...I would think it would be pretty scary.



Let's just say I wouldn't be super-excited about it unless I knew the area REALLY well. On a low light night, things can get even more sporty. I fly what can be accurately described as a pig. With fuel, it starts around 20K pounds, but I also have somewhere between 3200 and 3600 SHP to help me push it around. We also fly very specific profiles to come into a position to provide sniper support, so yanking and banking around a pig is more dynamic and can lead to more energy management than may be possible that low. And again, that's with lots of power. The civilian model used quite often is dealing with ~200-ish (plus) HP and a less dynamic rotor system (and lacks a very robust stability augmentation system that we have).

Can it be done? Absolutely. Have I chased deer in the middle of the night on goggles? Why are you asking me this? Of course not, as that would be wrong... But I just have a hard time putting my life in the hands of someone else when I know the thin margin for error in chasing pigs down low at night.

[UWone77]

You guys are ruining my dreams...

No biggie, I'm not a hunter, and generally don't want to kill anything unless I plan to eat it. Target practice from a Helo maybe the best I can do.

[SINNER]

New Zealand in 2018. More helo's than cars where we are going. Have friends there who own a guide company and a handful of helicopters. Just cover your airfare...

2127

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[UWone77]

What type of Gun laws are we talking about in New Zealand? I think I can swing the postage for myself!

[alamo5000]

New Zealand is a fantastic place. I spent three months there and would go back in a heartbeat. I have a ton of friends down there. I'm not sure of the exact gun laws but I do know a lot of people can get them and silencers too. I can ask.

I'm telling you for sure. I've been to something like 50 countries and if you don't go anywhere else on the planet New Zealand should be at the top of the short list.

[SINNER]

Bringing anything in is a PITA. But they have whats known as a E license for pest control. That allows semi auto's. They have FAL's, AR's and some HK semi's. Honestly not sure the type of NV they have.

And as Alamo said cans are nothing over there. Browning A bolts come with a factory can installed.

[SINNER]

One of the guys over there. Weird little bolt guns are really popular.

https://www.facebook.com/ssrnz/?hc_ref=SEARCH&fref=nf

[schambers]

While we are on the subject of firearm ingenuity, I came across this video the other day. I've never heard of a system like this before and thought it was interesting.

Looks like these guys bought a system that allows them to fire air-powered projectiles from unmodified firearms.




https://youtu.be/XTyv5Z-3JVk

[UWone77]

Bringing anything in is a PITA. But they have whats known as a E license for pest control. That allows semi auto's. They have FAL's, AR's and some HK semi's. Honestly not sure the type of NV they have.

And as Alamo said cans are nothing over there. Browning A bolts come with a factory can installed.

If I traveled abroad, I wouldn't even try to mess with bringing my own rifles with me. I see a big problem getting them in and getting back into CONUS

[SINNER]

I even hate flying in CONUS with weapons. Big reason why I drive to hunt.

[Joelski]

I even hate flying in CONUS with weapons. Big reason why I drive to hunt.
This. Between airline rules and TSA, it just seems like too much hassle and risk.