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  1. #16
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    I think if you mentally equate the 300 BLK as a magnum pistol caliber you are coming at it correctly. As a rifle round it's pretty pathetic, especially the subs. I think the LeHigh bullets are the only 300 bullet that will expand worth a squat at subsonic velocities. The Barnes TAC-TX is a great choice, but is a super.

    I certainly enjoy shooting mine. I'll probably enjoy it more when I get my SBR and Griffin Paladin stamps, but subsonic for me will just be for range fun and I'll stick with Barnes for the HD loads.


  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by fledge View Post
    For example of subsonic HD round, YouTube the Lehigh Defense 194gr 300 blackout.



    Very interesting stuff.

  3. #18
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  4. #19
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    Ok here is a question...

    I know there are laws regarding shooting brass bullets (yes I said brass) but honestly I am not sure of the reason, what is and isn't true, or if like other things there is just no logic to such a law.

    I think the brass bullet thing applies to handguns correct? Or is it all guns? If that's the case though why can you shoot 100% copper bullets and not 100% brass bullets? Like other things it makes no sense. But then again maybe someone can explain it to me better.

    ===

    Anyway on to other subjects....that 194 grain brass Lehigh Defense bullet looks effin' awesome. They however are EXPENSIVE.

    If I go through and do this 300 BLK route in an ideal world I would find some 194 grain just regular bullets so I can essentially have a single load. Going into another caliber is a pain in the ass enough but having two or three different loads for that caliber and constantly having to re-zero the gun kind of sucks.

    That said since my primary purpose will be shooting steel targets or popping pigs from time to time I am wondering how to consolidate the whole load management thing into something affordable to shoot.

    For example before I was shooting 115gr 9mm bullets and I got all tooled up for that but my carry loads are 124 grain HP... but eventually I just shot up all the 115 bullets I had and consolidated everything under 124 and my reloads mimic the velocity of my carry rounds. Now almost all of my practice 9mm is 124. That said I also have a lot of 147 which I actually shoot way more than everything else but it's out of different firearms. I probably shoot 80% or more 147 grain because I am addicted to shooting suppressed. With 9mm it's a little easier because I just load a lot of one thing and I am done with it for a while.

    With a rifle though zeroing and rezeroing because you changed grain weights is kind of a PITA. With those Lehigh 194's they are like a buck something PER BULLET. That's just a bullet. Loaded rounds are $2 a round or more. That is insanity.

    I am now really wondering how expensive it will be to shoot this damn thing. I am trying to think through the whole thing before I commit to anything. If my ammo costs are THAT high I might skip the .300 BLK thing all together.

  5. #20
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    Are the Nosler 190 grain close enough for reloading? They are relatively cheap especially buying blems x 1000. Then save the Lehighs for serious stuff.
    “What in the world is a moderate interpretation of a constitutional text? Halfway between what it says and what we'd like it to say?" -Antonin Scalia

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uffdaphil View Post
    Are the Nosler 190 grain close enough for reloading? They are relatively cheap especially buying blems x 1000. Then save the Lehighs for serious stuff.
    I've never reloaded 300 BLK. It's kind of a weird round. Not quite rifle not quite pistol.

    Reloading for pistol is a lot more forgiving than doing some serious rifle work. Usually in a rifle jumping that many grains would mean switching the powder drop.

    I just looked up the 190 grain bullets and those are more like it. .25 cents a round isn't too bad. I would probably come in at .30-.35 cents per round with those.

    In theory if I bought a crap load of those (or something similarly priced) it would serve 95% of my needs. If I could make my gun run subs with that grain is a whole different ball of wax. I am sure it can be done but these are things I want to ask before not after.

    For example I have my cheapy 10/22 and I have tried all sorts of ammo. The .22 ammo people all try different ways to get to 'subsonic'. Some use the same grain weight bullet and just back off the charge. Others use heavier bullets. There are 3 or 4 ways to get there. Not all are effective and not all will cycle my gun. I just want to make sure I have a good supply of cheap components that will work.

    I am sure it won't be an issue but it's something to learn about before I go all in.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by alamo5000 View Post
    Reloading for pistol is a lot more forgiving than doing some serious rifle work.
    .380 ACP is NOT forgiving at all!!!! You can quadruple charge a casing and still have room for a bullet lol


    Quote Originally Posted by Uffdaphil View Post
    Are the Nosler 190 grain close enough for reloading? They are relatively cheap especially buying blems x 1000. Then save the Lehighs for serious stuff.

    Which Nosler 190gr? Custom Competition? Accu Bond?

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Former11B View Post
    .380 ACP is NOT forgiving at all!!!! You can quadruple charge a casing and still have room for a bullet lol
    What kind of powder are you using? I use Universal and it's pretty easy. One drop and boom. Done.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uffdaphil View Post
    Are the Nosler 190 grain close enough for reloading? They are relatively cheap especially buying blems x 1000. Then save the Lehighs for serious stuff.
    You are on the right track though for sure. At a dollar something PER BULLET I am halfway inclined to tell the Lehigh people no thank you. I am not sure of the terminal performance of those cheaper bullets you mention but for 90% of my shooting it won't matter. As long as it's quiet and cheap to shoot it will serve it's purpose. 90% plus of my shooting will be just plinking around and having fun so the cheaper the better.

  10. #25
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    I use the Miller Lite vs. Stella Artois analogy. I can get a thousand rounds of Federal for $250 vs. 500 of 300 BLK subs for around the same price, maybe closer to $300. I'll have a can I can use on both rifles before my next one comes along, and I don't do ranges other than to train at certain times. I can shoot up the countryside and run the piss out of my .556 rifles for cheap and when I want to bask in mega OP coolness, I can switch over to subs and the BO. That's a lot of shooting for me. I'm lucky to average 500 - 1,000 rnds per month, more or less. Yes, I do want to reload eventually, but I'll get to it when I can. In the meantime, it's much cheaper to shoot heavy supers at around what it costs to reload using Alamo's math, so where is the motivation to reload? I can still shoot the hell out of my 300 and be satisfied for less than shooting all subs all the time.

    Gator: I have no yearning for a MP5, so that's a big pile of ammo right there.

    The last time I saw an all brass bullet, it was on a Beo casing and you have seen expensive until you price that shit! Beo uppers are cheepy cheep because the ammo will put you in the po house! I blinked at .45/70, but not anymore. I want a lever gun in my collection that can sling a big chunk of whatever and that's gonna be it.

    OT: I've gotta buy a bird gun before November, preferably a Semi-Auto for a guided Quail Hunt. Anybody here use guns on stuff besides paper and bad guys?

    I have a Les Paul and a couple of vintage Kramer electrics calling my name as well. People think I have cancer, it's just GAS! Gear poverty is a great diet! :)
    There's no "Team" in F**K YOU!

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by alamo5000 View Post
    What kind of powder are you using? I use Universal and it's pretty easy. One drop and boom. Done.
    I use titegroup. I mean you'd have to be really not paying attention to drop four charges in there but the tiny charge is really unforgiving

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by alamo5000 View Post
    You are on the right track though for sure. At a dollar something PER BULLET I am halfway inclined to tell the Lehigh people no thank you.
    Lehigh has sales during the major holidays and you can usually knock 10% of their price. Those bullets aren't for plinking, they're for whatever work you need them to do. You can plink with other ammo.

    Several years ago, PSA was selling Hornady 220s for some ridiculous price (I think it came to $.40/round), so I grabbed 250 or so. If I end up doing something that requires my 300BO to be rezeroed, I'll use the Hornady to get close, and then I usually only need 5 rounds of the Lehigh to refine/confirm.

    I know everyone's gun is different, but FWIW, when I plug in a MZ of something pretty close to what comes out of my 10.5", I get a max point blank range of 0-75y (within about 1.5") with a 25y zero. For my use, I don't need much beyond that, and since the subs plummet beyond 75y, the math all works in my favor. Zeroing at 25y keeps the round count (and price!) down to make it all work.

    I completely understand that may not be compatible with pig hunting, so obviously adjust as needed.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uffdaphil View Post
    Are the Nosler 190 grain close enough for reloading? They are relatively cheap especially buying blems x 1000. Then save the Lehighs for serious stuff.
    This is the route I'm going. I'm getting pretty good subsonic results with 1680 (holy shit, this powder is dirty. I had to swap my chrome BCG into my SBR). I'll try to buy some Lehigh HD subs and run a test, then keep 2 mags for when needed.

    But man oh man, is it fun to shoot.

  14. #29
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    alamo,

    I've got a 16" Wilson Combat 300 BO upper I was either going to sell or part out. If you want to shoot it long term let me know, you can play with it for awhile before you decide what to do.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by UWone77 View Post
    alamo,

    I've got a 16" Wilson Combat 300 BO upper I was either going to sell or part out. If you want to shoot it long term let me know, you can play with it for awhile before you decide what to do.
    I am definitely game! I sent you a PM.

    ---

    Carrying on the conversation I have heard that 300 BLK is 'optimized' for shorter barrels. I am just curious as to details about the gas system and people's preferred barrel lengths.

    With 5.56 on my 10.5 there is always discussion about dwell time, but with the 300 BLK I would like to hear more about pistol length gas systems. I figure if I build an upper while I am waiting on my suppressor I am thinking that roughly 9" might be my sweet spot but I am not married to anything. That's just a rough starting point.

    I just glanced at Ballistic Advantage website and their 300 BLK barrels go from 8" to 9.5" (They have more but that is what I am considering depending on what I learn).

    I would also like a good fitment between the rail and the suppressor and my current 10.5 with a 9.7 rail fits great. That is a .8" difference for a near perfect fit.

    9.5" barrel would mean a 8.7" rail
    9" barrel would be a 8.2" rail
    8.5" barrel would be a 7.7" rail

    Other than rail fitment I am curious if there is a dwell time issue with this round using a pistol length gas system. If anyone has any comments on that aspect please share.
    Last edited by alamo5000; 29 August 2017 at 14:33.

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