Please recommend a good non WML flashlight...

[PJD642]

Not having a charged phone is like walking around with a pistol that only has half the magazine filled with ammo. When you need to use your phone, it should work, and if you are somewhere you may need to use it for a prolonged period of time then you should be able to do so without any such issues of it not being charged.

OMD, the number of people we deal with every year "I'm lost in the woods and it's getting dark and I can't stay on the phone with dispatch because I've only got 4% battery life". And everyone is apparently too busy facebooking or tweeting or instagramming or whatever about being lost & eaten by a bear to take 15 seconds to open their map app & send location to a friend, or open the compass app and give dispatch the coordinates...Darwin's constant spinning in his grave should be harnessed as a source of eternal power.

[voodoo_man]

OMD, the number of people we deal with every year "I'm lost in the woods and it's getting dark and I can't stay on the phone with dispatch because I've only got 4% battery life". And everyone is apparently too busy facebooking or tweeting or instagramming or whatever about being lost & eaten by a bear to take 15 seconds to open their map app & send location to a friend, or open the compass app and give dispatch the coordinates...Darwin's constant spinning in his grave should be harnessed as a source of eternal power.

People think a phone is an accessory but it is actually as important as any tool you carry.

How else can you immediately summon people to your location who can bring everything from food to helicopters to swat teams? You cannot any other way.

Keep your shit charged up.

[Aragorn]

People think a phone is an accessory but it is actually as important as any tool you carry.

How else can you immediately summon people to your location who can bring everything from food to helicopters to swat teams? You cannot any other way.

Keep your shit charged up.

.....it also functions as a flashlight.

[gatordev]

Not having a charged phone is like walking around with a pistol that only has half the magazine filled with ammo.

When you need to use your phone, it should work, and if you are somewhere you may need to use it for a prolonged period of time then you should be able to do so without any such issues of it not being charged.

Flashlights are no different.

But for these purposes, we're not talking about a charged phone, we're talking about a ready-to-use flashlight. Times I've reached for my non-rechargable flashlight and it hasn't worked has been exactly once. Times I've reached for a phone that gets charged every 1-2 days and it's been lower than I wanted...more than a few times. And again, I don't really spend a ton of time on my phone.

People think a phone is an accessory but it is actually as important as any tool you carry.

How else can you immediately summon people to your location who can bring everything from food to helicopters to swat teams? You cannot any other way.

Keep your shit charged up.

Well, a radio comes to mind...

A phone is great when it works, but not everyone lives or works in a place where a phone is THE reliable source of salvation. Stray a few miles from an interstate when beyond a city (or CONUS), and its use drops off quickly. Ever been out west? I've gone a whole day without cell service. But a flashlight that requires minimal thinking and only a minimal scheduled maintenance cycle will still work fine. They aren't always an apples-to-apples comparison.

But again, buy what works for you.

[ChattanoogaPhil]

But again, buy what works for you.

Right.

And while 99% of my flashlight use is with rechargeable, of course I toss a Surefire 12-pack in the truck and another in the kitchen drawer. With a 10-year shelf life why not, right? Along with extra Lithium AA and AAA too...

Talking about kitchen drawers... I got the perfect kitchen drawer light. It's an old Surefire G3 3x CR123 with a Malkoff M61LL drop-in. Regulated runtime is something like 12hrs + a ton of taper down time. For the limited use it gets, it's good for years on a set of standard Surefire batteries. Funny... the most I paid for a flashlight is one I never use, a Surefire P3X. I thought it was going to be the best flashlight... but just didn't work for me.

When it comes to flashlights there's a ton of choices. I can't help but say yes.














.

[voodoo_man]

Been to plenty of places where I don't get service. That's why I have a radio which can access an 8call90 band with me when I go out there, only to be used in absolutely dire circumstances. Otherwise a phone can still do a lot for you even without service. Lots of very useable apps which don't need service to function properly.

As for flashlights, just the money savings alone warrants not buying a light which needs batteries. If you are stuck somewhere you cannot get service and don't have power then you should have a solar powered battery charger, or two. A decently sized one can charge a flashlight full with no problems, amongst other things.

In the next decade you'll see battery flashlights (as well as other things) slowly phased out while charging via USB/solar will be phased in.

[ChattanoogaPhil]

As for flashlights, just the money savings alone warrants not buying a light which needs batteries.

I use a Streamlight Stinger 800 lumen rechargeable about 30 minutes every night. A comparable light would be my Surefire P3X 3x CR123. It's rated a 1k lumens but only for about 2 minutes then operates in regulation at 600-500 lumens for 2hrs before falling off a cliff.

So.... 300 nights X 30min = 150 flashlight hours per year = 225 CR123 batteries. One of the cheapest places I have found to buy batteries is B&H Photo. 72-pack Surefire CR123 is $129 delivered. Sometimes cheaper on eBay for older batteries. According to my abacus... it would cost about $400 to fill the trash can with dead CR123 batteries. Find a super deal on batteries... call it $300+.

[alamo5000]

Looks like I dun stirred up sumthin'. LOL!!!

OK, serious biness question on the 123 vs the AAA (or AA), for those of you that prefer either or.

My idea for a light is to have one that I can throw light fairly far (in my definition of far). I can illuminate out easily 75 to 100 yards with either my Arisaka 300 series or now my 300x Surefire.

For some reason or another I am under the impression that the 123 batteries put out more juice and hence more potential light. Does an AAA light have the capability to throw light that far? I am talking sheerly based on the power factor...

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Side note--I totally get the concept of carrying a small, light weight non intrusive light. That idea appeals to me on a whole number of levels and I am very tempted to get a small light like that. It seems very very handy. That said for right now I want a light that has extra horsepower should I ever need to scan the parking lot before going to the ATM or whatever.

I am not intentionally ruling out AAA lights but for some reason or another I am under the impression that those lights wouldn't have a fair comparison to say a light like my Arisaka 300 series (single 123 battery).

Living in the country I have 1000 times more chance that somebody's cows got out of the pen (and into the road) or some situation like that where being able to scan a wide area fast would be way more useful. I don't think an AAA light would provide this capability, but I could be totally wrong. I don't know who has tried running over a 2000 pound bull at 65mph in a Nissan but I assure you it's not fun.

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As far as rechargeable batteries go I am thinking in two different ways. If the unit has a built in battery that cannot be just swapped out, that sucks (to me). I wouldn't want that for a light. When I thought about rechargeable batteries I think when they run down I can take it out and recharge and in the mean time have a spare with me so I can just swap if needed. Reason for that being is if I get caught with a dead battery I can swap in just a minute. Also I am not confident in built in batteries. If the battery goes, the whole unit goes. At least that's how I am trained to think.

If rechargeable batteries just suck all together I will just buy another box of Surefire batteries and toss em when dead and replace as needed. It's no real skin off my back either way because 99% of the time I am not working in life or death situations.

I just thought buying a half dozen rechargeable ones will save me cash in the long run.

[alamo5000]

you can reference this post - http://www.vdmsr.com/2016/11/streaml...ac-hl-usb.html - as to what I am referring to.

It has a micro USB plug and works just fine on a single charge, even for duty use.

I have to admit that does look appealing. I could charge my light when I charge my phone in the car. I have a Y connector so it's as simple as getting another cord.

NOW---that said---since the conversation turned to phones... my Android phone (older model) loses charge rather quickly vs when it was new. Fortunately I always buy a spare battery when I buy a phone. When I charge (or overcharge) my experience with cel phones is the life of the battery definitely decreases over time given the same amount of use.

Not sure how that specific light fares over time but that has been my experience with all my phones.

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As others have pointed out everybody has unique needs...I live in hurricane country so I bought a converter for my car for the express purpose to be able to charge my laptop or any other small device while on the the go. Going without power for days on end is pretty frequent during storms.

Also the talk of 'cold weather' makes me chuckle since it literally was 109 degrees in the frickin' shade here yesterday. If ANYTHING I need to be worried about the HEAT.

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Other experience is with my DSLR camera gear I can run my camera off of AA batteries if I want to. They have the dedicated battery for the camera, but also it comes with a tray that holds AA's. I could in theory run my camera anywhere on the planet and as long as I have a stash of AA's I am ok. I have a flash unit too that I played with for a while that sucks the life right out of AA batteries. Hence I invested in a bunch of rechargeable AA's. I haven't bought a battery in ages. I just periodically recharge and go on about my business.

[ChattanoogaPhil]

Living in the country I have 1000 times more chance that somebody's cows got out of the pen (and into the road) or some situation like that where being able to scan a wide area fast would be way more useful. I don't think an AAA light would provide this capability, but I could be totally wrong. I don't know who has tried running over a 2000 pound bull at 65mph in a Nissan but I assure you it's not fun.

High performance AAA keychain lights are not intended for field use. Their small size is intended for convenient to carry limited personal use to always have illumination on hand, always. If you want to herd animals at night get a robust high capacity/output light for those type of uses. And you'll never notice that you're still carrying that AAA or compact AA flashlight at the same time. I mean... while I always have a AAA flashlight in my jeans watch pocket, if I wanted to chase or tip cows at night I'd just grab the Malkoff MD2 from the glovebox. Also have a headlamp...

[alamo5000]

High performance AAA keychain lights are not intended for field use. Their small size is intended for convenient to carry personal use to always have illumination on hand, always. If you want to herd animals at night get a robust high capacity/output light for those type of uses. And you'll never notice that you're still carrying that AAA or compact AA flashlight at the same time.

It's not that I WANT to herd animals at night... that's just an example of a realistic situation... more than once I was out flagging down oncoming traffic or getting the cows off the road so somebody didn't get killed.

If I go down to Houston and want to scan across a dark parking lot would be another good example...IE checking out the potential for a car jacker or whatever.

FWIW, I am now actually thinking of getting two lights. One for a keychain for small stuff (to replace the aging one I have now) and a slightly bigger one with more horsepower.

My keys are my keys so that is not 'adding' much to replace that light, but for a slightly bigger one that has more HP, that's really where I am focusing on. Something that can be more for my EDC, be prepared, bug out, patrol kit.

[SINNER]

I've got to agree with Phil on this one regarding battery quality and apparent parasitic discharge by the Elzetta. I use a Surefire Peacekeeper P1R with a tailswitch swapped out for a clicky-type carried on my belt, and use almost it every day for varying periods of time. Maybe once every two weeks I notice it getting weaker, and I swap it out for a charged spare I carry in the cruiser. Never noticed an appreciable loss from sitting unused, either in the flashlight or in the duty bag.

For a light that might get used once a year or so (like in my personal car's console) I've got one of Gene Malkoff's older model lights with 2 CR123 batteries in it.

Not sure where the idea of parasitic loss was attributed to the light but that’s a baseless, incorrect assumption. No issues with normal batteries for 6-7 months that light has sat idle. It’s directly attributed to the known issues with rechargeable batteries. Even the older Elzettas that use the inferior Malkoff LED’S have never shown an issue.

[voodoo_man]

Just a list of things that I have found to be true throughout my experience in real world application - no particular order:

The more lumens the better, I will gladly sacrifice comfort, run time and functionality (like ten tap/programmable/etc) for high lumen output to blind people into doing what I want them to do.

Cell phones are consumable. I don't know why people keep phones for 3+ years, they are not designed to last that long without having to swap parts out. I buy a new phone (google brand every sept/oct when they release a new one) every single year. I do this because I don't want to worry about my phone having hiccups in service, functionality or connectivity. The different between a Nexus 5x and the Pixel 2 which I have (which are about 3 years apart at this point) is night and day. It is a tool just like anything else, don't skimp on it. We live in a connected world, you need to be able to properly use your tools to increase your overall productivity. Buy a new phone every year or buy a new phone every new model of that phone (usually a year).

Stay away from stuff that doesn't have recharge and requires non-rechargeable batteries. I've saved $1000+ in batteries in the last few years if you do the math on the various flashlights I use, the DSLR/Flashes, the other various items I use premium rechargeable batteries in (enelope pro for AAA/AA).

Do not be afraid to try new technology, yes it may be annoying to get used to and it may not do exactly what you want it to originally because its different, give it time and try to see how it works out. The worst possible thing you can do is stagnate and become stuck in your particular comfort zone with technology. Evolve not just your tech but your understanding of how its applied.

[ChattanoogaPhil]

Stay away from stuff that doesn't have recharge and requires non-rechargeable batteries. I've saved $1000+ in batteries in the last few years if you do the math on the various flashlights I use, the DSLR/Flashes, the other various items I use premium rechargeable batteries in (enelope pro for AAA/AA).

Yup. I use KeepPower 18650 and eneloop pro AAA and AA.
Quality rechargeable in quality flashlights = outstanding performance and reliability, economical too.

AAA Surfire AA Malkoff 18650 Malkoff.

[ChattanoogaPhil]

Not sure where the idea of parasitic loss was attributed to the light but that’s a baseless, incorrect assumption. No issues with normal batteries for 6-7 months that light has sat idle. It’s directly attributed to the known issues with rechargeable batteries. Even the older Elzettas that use the inferior Malkoff LED’S have never shown an issue.

IIRC, I had posted both possibilities of flashlight parasitic drain or battery issues in reply to your description of inferior performance. If I made that confusing I apologize.

For all the readership knows, you were using a cheap 2100 mAh or damaged 18650 vs two 1500 mAh CR123. The bored out Elzetta still might have abnormally high parasitic drain but it was more painfully obvious with a cheap low capacity 18650. Without any detail no one knows... and with so much back and forth I doubt any cares at this point.

What I can offer the readership is the 18650 KeepPower 3500 mAh can be stored in the Malkoff MD2 with an M61 for many weeks and still perform in line with the runtime graphs earlier posted and are widely reviewed as among the best rechargeable in their class. As well, the eneloop pro AA and AAA are rated to retain 90% charge after 6 months in storage, 85% after a year and 70% after 10 years IIRC. While my lights with rechargeable batteries don't go unused for years at time, the rated performance is quite impressive. Battery technology has come a long way in recent years.