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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Former11B View Post
    The vast majority of centerfire rifle cans aren’t serviceable...I imagine they don’t sell a whole lot of them despite the features. The .30 cal Paladin is really light and durable though
    They even say in their ads that 'unless you are a very high volume shooter you don't need this'.

    From what I understand that whole thing is at least partially there for better and easier service in the event of a baffle strike or whatever.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoilerUp View Post
    Seems like the user serviceable Paladin line has some qualities that would still make it attractive versus a tubeless design.
    Iím a noob, but I see the attraction to wanting to pull it apart per say.

    Quote Originally Posted by Joelski View Post
    I find myself wanting to call b.s. on that claim. My Alpha tames my .308, but I'm not taking off my ear pro.

    I'd love to be proven wrong, and I'd especially like to see a compelling price. As much of a like him or don't guy KMFB is, I am falling for the cherry bomb method of attaching cans to barrels. As IMO, the taper mount is hands down the best way to attach, putting the threads after the taper makes sense, as does his theory that the problem with G.A. cans is carbon lock as a result of the design.
    Kmfb? I have no loyalty towards anyoneís cans or products...Iím lost..lol....and Iím not up to par on whatís best , but yes the taper mount looks good.

    Quote Originally Posted by SINNER View Post
    Anyone claiming a .308 can is hearing safe is a fool or a liar.
    Ya Iím not sure, still gotta be decently loud..but idk..

    Hereís the griffin dudes quote from ar15dotcom today.

    Originally Posted By Green0:
    I designed the Explorr cans because it seemed like a logical place to go. I wanted to make something high performance in weight, in size, and performance for that size. We didn't design them because they would obsolete current offerings in the lineup.

    The current Recoil magazine is featuring the new Paladin 5. It's a new silencer.

    The Explorr product does some neat stuff. The Paladin also does some unique stuff. The Recce cans compete favorably with cans from big corporations that are built on a high volume model, and they are one of the cleaner looking options on the market doing that.

    Ear safe 6.5" .308.. I was happy with that. That's what the Explorr does well. Being the size of a 5.56mm can and being competitive on a .308.
    Dont kill the messenger....

  3. #18
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    Iíve never had an issue with carbon lock with my griffin taper mounts. I posted a link to my insta where I show one of my mounts that has over 7800 rounds fired through, not a single issue with carbon lock.

    Q always posts pics of the cherry bomb with the nice clean section behind his taper, but I wonder what would happen if someone shoots a ton of rounds unsupresssd? I wonder if there would be enough carbon build up on the front taper to cause misalignment?

    https://www.instagram.com/p/Btzq1yqH...=1vqh7ew8z7ifh

    Quote Originally Posted by Joelski View Post
    I'd love to be proven wrong, and I'd especially like to see a compelling price. As much of a like him or don't guy KMFB is, I am falling for the cherry bomb method of attaching cans to barrels. As IMO, the taper mount is hands down the best way to attach, putting the threads after the taper makes sense, as does his theory that the problem with G.A. cans is carbon lock as a result of the design.
    Quote Originally Posted by alamo5000 View Post
    I've seen people argue online about that and honestly it's a pretty stupid topic to even discuss. The differences are so minute it makes hardly no difference if both systems are maintained. If the shooter is a complete lazy ass and knows he's a lazy ass then by all means go threads after. If he doesn't want to take his can off the rifle for a year, fine. On the other hand the taper surface on the can and mount itself is the most critical part to getting the best most consistent lock up and alignment. If your taper gets fouled up it can have other issues. Wiping down the mount with a greasy old rag and wiping off the taper surface on the can every once in a while is not too much to ask.

    Sometimes I think people just hunt for a reason to fight.
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  4. #19
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    5.56 cans are barely hearing safe. I still wear ears with all suppressed shooting. 308? Fugggeddabout it

    I see no reason to have a serviceable centerfire can vs, a full welded core.

    At this point everyone is basically making a baffle stack design can, using inconel as the first baffle. The only thing that sets cans apart are price, mounting attachment designs, and "tone" what it sounds like.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joelski View Post
    I find myself wanting to call b.s. on that claim. My Alpha tames my .308, but I'm not taking off my ear pro.

    You only have so much hearing, and it doesn't recover. Pete Townsend couldn't hear a jet engine next to him, and he tried for years to save his hearing.

    I'd love to be proven wrong, and I'd especially like to see a compelling price. As much of a like him or don't guy KMFB is, I am falling for the cherry bomb method of attaching cans to barrels. As IMO, the taper mount is hands down the best way to attach, putting the threads after the taper makes sense, as does his theory that the problem with G.A. cans is carbon lock as a result of the design.
    Q is full of it. He pretends heís invented everything in the suppressor industry first and everything else is a copy of his work. Despite getting over 30 patents rejected recently for not being original...but I digress

    And Griffinís taper works just fine. The top thread has a tapered surface and Iíve never had one get carbon locked before

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    As far as the hearing safe thing goes; are they saying a suppressed bolt gun is hearing safe or a semi auto?

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by VIPER 237 View Post
    Iíve never had an issue with carbon lock with my griffin taper mounts. I posted a link to my insta where I show one of my mounts that has over 7800 rounds fired through, not a single issue with carbon lock.

    Q always posts pics of the cherry bomb with the nice clean section behind his taper, but I wonder what would happen if someone shoots a ton of rounds unsupresssd? I wonder if there would be enough carbon build up on the front taper to cause misalignment?

    https://www.instagram.com/p/Btzq1yqH...=1vqh7ew8z7ifh
    Exactly. If the taper surface gets carboned up you have a whole different set of problems.



    Quote Originally Posted by Former11B View Post
    Q is full of it. He pretends heís invented everything in the suppressor industry first and everything else is a copy of his work. Despite getting over 30 patents rejected recently for not being original...but I digress

    And Griffinís taper works just fine. The top thread has a tapered surface and Iíve never had one get carbon locked before


    As far as the hearing safe thing goes; are they saying a suppressed bolt gun is hearing safe or a semi auto?
    I am guessing bolt action. Very few if any semi autos would be hearing safe...

    I have never had a single problem one with Griffin's taper mount. I heard of one gun guy on Youtube that I called a complete stupid ass though. He mounted his can to a machine gun for 18 months straight and then wondered why there was carbon build up.

    At the end of the day the expansion and contraction of the metals involved lead to more lock up than anything. If the can is hot and you keep on ratcheting it down on there over and over naturally it's going to be a snug fit.

  7. #22
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    The one advantage of a user serviceable can is the ability to shoot rimfire and clean it afterwards.
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  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by mustangfreek View Post
    I’m a noob, but I see the attraction to wanting to pull it apart per say.



    Ya I’m not sure, still gotta be decently loud..but idk..

    Here’s the griffin dudes quote from ar15dotcom today.
    I think I read somewhere that the take apart cans (like I said in another post) helps Griffin's service department do turnaround time in like half the time. No cutting welds or whatever...they can just fix a baffle strike and send it out in short order.

    Initially I thought I would like to take my cans apart too...but after a few years of shooting with them it's not an issue at all.

    As for the hearing safe at the ear thing.... Silencer Shop did a test of the Explorr on .308 bolt action. Go to 0:40 seconds and it shows an at the ear reading of 131.17 DB according to SS tests. I would assume this is what GA was referring to, not semi auto.


  9. #24
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    Some good info here.thanks

    Ya Iím just repeating what others are saying.... soaking up the info

    Keep on going...
    Last edited by mustangfreek; 23 March 2019 at 01:24.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by alamo5000 View Post
    I am guessing bolt action. Very few if any semi autos would be hearing safe...
    Action isn't what makes something hearing-safe. It only determines the various levels of noise. At the end of the day, physics will always win. Anything going super-sonic will make a significant noise. A can can't stop that, only the "explosion" that makes it go. This is where I think people get silly. There is always hope that the next can will be quieter, but at the end of the day, you can't beat external noises.

    A normal 5.56 load is going to be loud because it's going supersonic. A .308 round is going to be louder because it's a bigger mass moving through the air causing a collapse of said air. In the same vein, this is why supersonic bullets are loud, but supersonic airplanes can break windows. A suppressor isn't going to change that. Honestly I think this becomes much easier to understand when standing downrange when a round is fired. The report of the rifle isn't the audible concern, it's the bullet passing by.

  11. #26
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    The easiest way to teach someone the difference is to take their muffs away. Subsonic + can = generally hearing safe. Super + no can = skull cracker.
    There's no "Team" in F**K YOU!

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Former11B View Post
    Q is full of it. He pretends he’s invented everything in the suppressor industry first and everything else is a copy of his work. Despite getting over 30 patents rejected recently for not being original...but I digress

    And Griffin’s taper works just fine. The top thread has a tapered surface and I’ve never had one get carbon locked before.
    The dude is a narcissistic doucher of the highest order. He stole .300 BLK too. The .300 Whisper was designed up the road in Cadiz. The theory looked plausible. I've only got 4k-ish rounds through my Alpha so far, and I've never so much as looked down the bore. It works great, although the stories of stuck muzzle devices kinda says to me they should put wrench flats on the MD's. and matching ones on the ass end of the suppressor to negate red loctite for any length of time as a solution to a stuck can.
    There's no "Team" in F**K YOU!

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by gatordev View Post
    Action isn't what makes something hearing-safe. It only determines the various levels of noise. At the end of the day, physics will always win. Anything going super-sonic will make a significant noise. A can can't stop that, only the "explosion" that makes it go. This is where I think people get silly. There is always hope that the next can will be quieter, but at the end of the day, you can't beat external noises.

    A normal 5.56 load is going to be loud because it's going supersonic. A .308 round is going to be louder because it's a bigger mass moving through the air causing a collapse of said air. In the same vein, this is why supersonic bullets are loud, but supersonic airplanes can break windows. A suppressor isn't going to change that. Honestly I think this becomes much easier to understand when standing downrange when a round is fired. The report of the rifle isn't the audible concern, it's the bullet passing by.
    I agree 100%. No disagreement at all. Bullets will create turbulence and there will be the sonic crack. The larger the bullet the larger the crack.

    One thing that you left out (that I was referring to) wasn't so much the action but rather the port pop of a semi auto. Hot gas trapped in a tube and when you open that up it creates a boom/pop of it's own. On the muzzle all that is blasted out the front, but on a semi auto hot gas is blasted back down the bore of the gun-- and as soon as the action opens it creates a loud pop. This is what makes a lot of guns not hearing safe at the ear, the unsealing of that hot gas at such a close proximity to the shooter's face is noisy aside from just the action.

    Bolt action has no such problem. All the gas heads one direction. The supersonic bullet crack, depending on the firearm and length of barrel happens downrange. Exactly how far down range I don't know because it depends on the barrel length and other factors. All I know is port pop is a real thing caused by hot gas escaping out the port when the action opens, which is typically just inches from the shooter's face, and that doesn't happen with a bolt gun.

    The bullet turbulence is one thing and the sonic crack is another but all that being blasted in one direction away from the shooter with a longer barrel on a bolt gun certainly doesn't hurt.

    Here are a couple of cool videos that I think are applicable. The first one is from Military Arms and the second from Griffin. The first one shows actual metered down range bullet noise, and the second one clearly demonstrates how 'blast' can be directed away from the shooter. You can fast forward the second video to 4:10 to see actual metered data if you want.

    MAC:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZ_BgeG0P1o

    Griffin:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k7wM_7kAv6g

    Both principles are at play.

  14. #29
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    If I am not mistaken the sonic crack of a .30 cal bullet independent of any gun noise (just purely flight noise) will be dependent upon the bullet design but it's generally around 140ish DB.

    But what also happens is an unsuppressed shot sends sound waves out in a much more circular cone pattern, like throwing a rock in a pond. With a bolt action and a suppressor it's more like a mushroom.

  15. #30
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    More nerd videos. Interesting stuff. Ultra high speed footage that captures the muzzle blast unsuppressed and suppressed.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BPwdlEgLn5Q


    Second video is specifically regarding suppressors.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IAR4yTYslkk
    Last edited by alamo5000; 23 March 2019 at 01:35.

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