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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by alamo5000 View Post
    One thing that you left out (that I was referring to) wasn't so much the action but rather the port pop of a semi auto. Hot gas trapped in a tube and when you open that up it creates a boom/pop of it's own. On the muzzle all that is blasted out the front, but on a semi auto hot gas is blasted back down the bore of the gun-- and as soon as the action opens it creates a loud pop. This is what makes a lot of guns not hearing safe at the ear, the unsealing of that hot gas at such a close proximity to the shooter's face is noisy aside from just the action.
    I knew what you were saying, and agree, port noise is loud, but how loud is the action noise? How much of the loudness is the gas and how much of it is the action moving back and forth? A rhetorical question, but the point is constantly being subjected to noise at a fixed frequency, even if it's "hearing safe" still has the potential to cause damage. I cringe when I'm in a bullet's supersonic cone without muffs because it hurts a little (happens regularly at matches) but I don't cringe at port pop the same way. But I don't want to subject myself to either if I can help it.

    But we're in agreement, a can can't really help either substantially.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by gatordev View Post
    but how loud is the action noise? How much of the loudness is the gas and how much of it is the action moving back and forth? A rhetorical question, but the point is constantly being subjected to noise at a fixed frequency, even if it's "hearing safe" still has the potential to cause damage.
    115 to 120 approximately Tack on another 25ish decibels for port pop on a standard AR15.

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    The real question for me that I haven't seen tested is how fast the sound dissipates with distance. For example a 145DB port pop going off a few inches from your face is clearly loud AF, but if you put that same 145DB 3x as far away how does it dissipate? Super nerd stuff and it's getting into the point of just sciency stuff but it would be interesting to learn.

    Based on really really rough math in my head the sound dissipates about 8 DB roughly 24 inches away from the shooter's face when shooting suppressed on a bolt action vs semi auto. That's just a general estimate.

  3. #33
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    I can't help it that I am a total nerd, but I find all this stuff fascinating. The science part of firearms scratches my brain and it's awesome fun to blast stuff as well.

    Gathering data like this is more ways to build better stuff and as a customer to buy things that are more awesome.

  4. #34
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    Or... you could just wear ears...

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by UWone77 View Post
    Or... you could just wear ears...
    I do 99% of the time BUUUUUT if I go hunting, at the ear suppression is good because I don’t wear ear pro in the woods

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Former11B View Post
    I do 99% of the time BUUUUUT if I go hunting, at the ear suppression is good because I don’t wear ear pro in the woods
    I don't hunt myself, but I see where you're coming from. I always wear ears, even with a can. Can't get back hearing when you lose it.

  7. #37
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    Port noise reduction is one of the reasons I like the OSS designs over the traditional baffle design, it’s quieter to the ear even if it’s louder at the muzzle, but as others have noted, past 100 yards or so you’re going to hear the supersonic crack much louder than the muzzle noise, so I prefer a quieter port noise than at the muzzle reading.
    FFL 07/ NFA 02
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  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by alamo5000 View Post
    115 to 120 approximately Tack on another 25ish decibels for port pop on a standard AR15.
    I figured values were out there. But still, 140-ish dB for port noise? Yikes! That will add up. Like UW said, just wear ears.

    Quote Originally Posted by Former11B View Post
    I do 99% of the time BUUUUUT if I go hunting, at the ear suppression is good because I don’t wear ear pro in the woods
    The single-biggest reason on why the discussion/argument still has validity. I don't hunt either, but I can totally understand the concern. At least the exposure is pretty minimal, relative to range plinking.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by UWone77 View Post
    I don't hunt myself, but I see where you're coming from. I always wear ears, even with a can. Can't get back hearing when you lose it.
    I dig the compromise of electronic hearing protection combined with earbuds. Not as good as plugs and a headset, but still better than plugs only and you can hear everything below 90-100 db.
    There's no "Team" in F**K YOU!

  10. #40
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    No problem wearing ears but I still like to see how far things can be pushed. Not in being dumb and just ignoring safety but like was said earlier, "evolution".

    At some point I think cans will get to somewhat of a plateau in performance, but I also think the next big wave in advancements will be in the ammo.

    Blended metals, polymer bullets, injection molding of projectiles, dual metal bullets, ultra high BC designs, and much more efficient and cleaner powders too are just a few things.

    How to make ultra long range, better terminal ballistics etc are all up.

    I tinkered around with my own loads and unconventional bullet and powder combinations, and while I don't have a fancy meter I notice full reliability and very reduced sound signatures.

    On Rex Reviews YouTube channel a few years ago he tested down range sound on ultra high BC bullets and the flight noise was substantially reduced.

    In other words I think the suppressor is obviously vital but we are just barely getting into the realm of possibilities in the big picture of things. Things like shooting a .30 cal bullet out past a grand or more but having downrange flight noise be like that of a. 22 LR.

    20 years from now we will look back going wow.

  11. #41
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    They've literally plateau'ed. Other than OSS, they're all baffle stack designs. Other than new materials and alloys that last longer and mounting systems, I have literally seen and heard little innovation in the suppressor arena. Look at the "new" designs the last decade. Modularity, multicaliber, length, ect have been addressed as well as what I already listed, but almost ZERO improvement in db reduction.

    My AAC M4-1000 18T was my first can in 2011. Still barely notice the difference between that one and a Silencerco Saker K 29 cans later.

    I think a lot of manufacturers have realized this, which has given rise to the K cans. Shorter, less sound suppression, but it doesn't matter as people want shorter cans and a lot of people already wear ear pro.

  12. #42
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    I want a KAC mini CQB but damn...
    There's no "Team" in F**K YOU!

  13. #43
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    Some good info came out of this

    Quote Originally Posted by Joelski View Post
    I want a KAC mini CQB but damn...
    Ya me too..

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by mustangfreek View Post
    Some good info came out of this
    If you can't tell, I love talking nerdy. The nerdier the better.

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joelski View Post
    I want a KAC mini CQB but damn...
    What is it that makes it "it" for you? I'm not arguing, as I understand it's pretty light, but it also seems about as loud to the ear as other Mini cans when I've seen it shot (I understand the numbers might be a little lower).

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