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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by gatordev View Post
    I feel like I've created my own Alamo thread.
    HaHa!!! Welcome to my world

    Now that you're on board I don't feel as weird about asking so many questions. LOL

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoilerUp View Post
    The recoil impulse between a blowback 9 and a .233 is very different.
    Is it sharper? Is it "harder hitting?" Obviously I'm not asking if it feels like a 308 gas gun, but is there more muzzle flip due to the impulse at the shoulder?


    I'm curious if a 22LR conversion kit would serve your purposes? I've always been tempted to try one of those. Then you are shooting your exact same rifle and mags have the same profile.
    Whoa, whoa, slow down there. If you're bringing 22LR back into the conversation, then I should just configure one my two .22 ARs and use them. The Nordic Component is a bit heavier, and the M&P22 is lighter, but either one would work and have pretty much zero expense. And how can we solve problems if we can't throw money at the problems?

    Honestly, this is probably the smartest move and I could just throw a spare Razor I have on one of these and call it a day. But I'm not always the smartest man.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by gatordev View Post
    Is it sharper? Is it "harder hitting?" Obviously I'm not asking if it feels like a 308 gas gun, but is there more muzzle flip due to the impulse at the shoulder?
    It will depend on the specifc gun of course, but to me it's more like you are feeling the bolt going back and forth more than the recoil from the round being fired itself. 9mm is obviously light recoil, but you have much more reciprocating mass.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoilerUp View Post
    It will depend on the specifc gun of course, but to me it's more like you are feeling the bolt going back and forth more than the recoil from the round being fired itself. 9mm is obviously light recoil, but you have much more reciprocating mass.
    Gotcha, that makes sense. Kind of like an op-rod AR.

  5. #20
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    AU has Colt 9mm 16" Carbines in stock for $999. That's about the best price I've seen lately on them.

    https://www.armsunlimited.com/Colt-9...e-p/ar6951.htm

  6. #21
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    Hence my original posit in the thread:

    The Colt would be the easiest solution and pretty cost effective at ~$1000, as all I would need to do is throw a rail that I already have on there...
    Ky Gun Co has them for a couple bucks more. AU seems to be hit and miss on shipping and tax, so AU is probably still the top contender. I still haven't made it down to my local gun store to see how impressed they are with their products.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by gatordev View Post
    Hence my original posit in the thread:



    Ky Gun Co has them for a couple bucks more. AU seems to be hit and miss on shipping and tax, so AU is probably still the top contender. I still haven't made it down to my local gun store to see how impressed they are with their products.
    AU is definitely hit and miss. In the last few months however, they've had the best prices (after you factor in shipping) on A Hellion and a M1A SOCOM16. The 4" Python was also tempting.

  8. #23
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    Okay, looking for a sanity check here, as I may have come up with an option that's a little less money but I'm not sure if it's cost effective.

    AU has the 6951 for $1021 out the door, and after the transfer fees, I'm probably looking at $1061 + the cost for mags. Let's just call the total $1100 with 3 mags on hand.

    I've found a 9mm CMMG radial delayed blowback barrel/BCG combo and a BCM upper receiver for $640 out the door. Add in two mag converters and I'm looking at $700. I have all of the other parts on hand to make it a complete upper. This then also allows me to run the upper on an existing AR-15 lower (which I have plenty) as well as giving me the option of cutting the barrel down, should I want to, and put it on a SBR AR lower (which it will probably already be sitting on).

    The local large gun store didn't have any 6951s in stock, which would have simplified this process.

    So $1100 vs $700 plus some gun-smithing (which the 6951 would need anyway). No extra pain in dealing with the transfer. Is the $400 savings worth it? Am I missing anything else?

  9. #24
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    If it was my money I would do the upper, and not just because it's cheaper. It gives a lot more flexibility in what you are doing. Plus this is a "substitution" as far as I can see so keeping the lower and the controls the same might be a benefit.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by gatordev View Post
    Okay, looking for a sanity check here, as I may have come up with an option that's a little less money but I'm not sure if it's cost effective.

    AU has the 6951 for $1021 out the door, and after the transfer fees, I'm probably looking at $1061 + the cost for mags. Let's just call the total $1100 with 3 mags on hand.

    I've found a 9mm CMMG radial delayed blowback barrel/BCG combo and a BCM upper receiver for $640 out the door. Add in two mag converters and I'm looking at $700. I have all of the other parts on hand to make it a complete upper. This then also allows me to run the upper on an existing AR-15 lower (which I have plenty) as well as giving me the option of cutting the barrel down, should I want to, and put it on a SBR AR lower (which it will probably already be sitting on).

    The local large gun store didn't have any 6951s in stock, which would have simplified this process.

    So $1100 vs $700 plus some gun-smithing (which the 6951 would need anyway). No extra pain in dealing with the transfer. Is the $400 savings worth it? Am I missing anything else?
    The $400 savings is probably worth it.

    You got enough weapons where future resale might be a factor too. If you don't like it and want to dump it, at least you can get your money out of the Colt. Is that worth $400? Leaning.... probably no... but I just like the roll mark.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by gatordev View Post
    Okay, looking for a sanity check here, as I may have come up with an option that's a little less money but I'm not sure if it's cost effective.

    AU has the 6951 for $1021 out the door, and after the transfer fees, I'm probably looking at $1061 + the cost for mags. Let's just call the total $1100 with 3 mags on hand.

    I've found a 9mm CMMG radial delayed blowback barrel/BCG combo and a BCM upper receiver for $640 out the door. Add in two mag converters and I'm looking at $700. I have all of the other parts on hand to make it a complete upper. This then also allows me to run the upper on an existing AR-15 lower (which I have plenty) as well as giving me the option of cutting the barrel down, should I want to, and put it on a SBR AR lower (which it will probably already be sitting on).

    The local large gun store didn't have any 6951s in stock, which would have simplified this process.

    So $1100 vs $700 plus some gun-smithing (which the 6951 would need anyway). No extra pain in dealing with the transfer. Is the $400 savings worth it? Am I missing anything else?
    Well, I'd be torn, too. Part of me says to get the factory gun as you know you'll end up building out a custom upper as a dedicated carbine, anyway. The Colt will almost certainly hold it's value better and is interesting to have in the collection regardless. But, I didn't realize you can get the CMMG barrel / bcg and drop into a mil-spec upper, so now I'm wondering if I can breathe new life into my EPC.

    So, sorry, I can't help you. Pros and cons either way. Why do you say the 6951 would need gun-smithing? Do you just mean you'd swap out some parts to make it match your other platform?

  12. #27
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    I also didnít realize you just needed the CMMG barrel/BCG with other parts non-proprietary. Thatís the way I would go as I am itching to try the delayed blowback. If you donít like it the CMMG combo would be an easy sale with most of the rest useful components for future AR builds.
    ď When I comes to modern politics, I think the inverse of Hanlon's Razor applies...In other words, "Never attribute to stupidity that which is adequately explained by malice." - Kerplode

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoilerUp View Post

    So, sorry, I can't help you. Pros and cons either way. Why do you say the 6951 would need gun-smithing? Do you just mean you'd swap out some parts to make it match your other platform?
    Correct. Based on my research, all it needs is a GI barrel nut (which I have), which is compatible with an already owned Centurion Arms 10" rail. I just realized that I need a new MIAD grip for the 6951, so there's another cost. The 6951 would also "need" a B5 stock, which the CMMG option would not.

    Quote Originally Posted by uwone77
    ... but I just like the roll mark.
    Don't get me wrong, I'm not above the emotional satisfaction of a roll mark. I'm just not sure it's worth $400 in this case....unless function goes out the window with my CMMG plan. Then I'll have regrets, do doubt.

  14. #29
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    I'm not savvy on 9mm external balistics... If I'm trying to roughly simulate height over bore of a 5.56 gun, and I'm shooting 9mm at 25y or less (probably 15-20y in the bays), I'm thinking a 50-ish yard zero would make that close enough, no?

    Progress so far. It looks absurd with the optic, I know, but remember it's a training gun. Still waiting on the muzzle thread protector. I'll build the mags up in the next couple of days. I'm hoping range day will be next week.


  15. #30
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    Better look at trajectories for different weight bullets. I shoot mostly sub-sonic 147-158 grains which fall off much sooner than lighter supers.

    Iím thinking a zero that corresponds to a 100 yard 5.56 would be good. The POI would never be over. Quick to estimate center mass. Not so hot for close up head shots. My 74 year old eyes are center mass only.
    ď When I comes to modern politics, I think the inverse of Hanlon's Razor applies...In other words, "Never attribute to stupidity that which is adequately explained by malice." - Kerplode

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