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  1. #1
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    People either like them, or they hate them...

    But not enough to put them out of binnet.

    Got this as a project gun. Been wanting a 1911 and now I have one that didn't cost me anything. Over the next little bit, it'll get exorcised of the evil MIM parts and re-worked with WC parts. At the end, maybe a nice, glossy 'kote, or some fancy bluing. I do like the tuxedo look. Yes Jim; those are DU grip medallions!

    20221004_154921.jpg
    There's no "Team" in F**K YOU!

  2. #2
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    I don't mind some Kimbers. RL/TLE II comes to mind.

  3. #3
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    No weapon more beautiful than a finely built, perfectly tuned 1911. Obviously, that's just my opinion, but I "grew up" on the things and still love them. I carry HK USP's almost all the time now, but I still love my 1911's.

    FT
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by FortTom View Post
    No weapon more beautiful than a finely built, perfectly tuned 1911. Obviously, that's just my opinion, but I "grew up" on the things and still love them. I carry HK USP's almost all the time now, but I still love my 1911's.
    FT
    I agree and carry the same thing, but there has always been something about them that appeals to my appreciation for artistic, functional design. For a base, this firearms has really great bones. It is tight as a Baer, at least as accurate as I am and hasn't malfed yet. I kind of question the need to exorcise the hated parts that seem to function just fine, but this is a learning project, and I hope to complete it with as few do-overs as possible.

    The learning part has run true-to-form for me. Although an average student, I have always excelled at things I take an interest in. So far, I'm in 4 books, a zillion videos and have several accomplished pistol smiths on speed dial. Gaining different perspectives, soaking up the wisdom and information takes me back to my early days in public safety when I lived and breathed my way through Fire, EMS and POTA!

    First project done. I like mag wells on 1911's. I brought the patience and discretion and learned hand-fitting one file stroke at a time. Easily the most important part is knowing where to remove metal in the stack from the top of the MSH to the top of the firing pin block pushrod. I don't know why, it just completes the look, IMO.

    20221019_202201.jpg
    Last edited by Joelski; 19 October 2022 at 17:38.
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  5. #5
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    90s Kimbers goodÖ.afterÖ.ehh

  6. #6
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    I got lucky. I wanted a project and now I have one and it didn't cost me a thing. Excising the MIM parts and learning the ins and outs of hand fitting parts as I go will correct the alleged sins of the company. Truthfully, it shoots fine, but I won't deny my compulsion to fck with stuff and make it better, if only for knowing it doesn't have cast parts anymore. It's accurate, takes what it's given, and its tight as a block of steel. It just happens to have a less than desirable roll stamp or two. I can live with that. This is also what I needed to influence my decision to purchase something pricier and more widely accepted as I now know I won't have buyer's remorse when I do make that move. A shitty gun might not have given me complete pause, but I don't buy on impulse (much) anymore.
    There's no "Team" in F**K YOU!

  7. #7
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    And so, my education 1911 pistolsmithing begins! Got the de-facto bibles, got all the parts necessary to relieve the Kimber of it's mim albatross, and I have a willing, established smith to help me with advice, established standards, etc.. I am going into this knowing I'm not going to increase the value of my project gun, other than to make it something I'll keep as my "first". For me, this is a far better use of discretionary funds than reloading as it's held my interest, transfers to basically any 1911 made, and provides an almost endless source of tools to acquire!

    For software, I have a lot more kindle books that I've picked up and gobbled the past month, giving me a range of builders and advisory content to pull from. To say it's not a cheap endeavor would be an understatement! Next step as far as ownership will be a DW of some sort. Still diggin' the SA Prodigy for a 2011, but it can still benefit from more time maturing and working out bugs although it seems the gun was magically fixed by swapping in a Checkmate mag; that simple swap cured much of the failures it experienced from failure to chamber to failure to eject and lockback issues. The BUL isn't a bad gun either, although its had teething problems, likely more related to being a relatively young company to the US market. It is nice though, having more budget-friendly options (relatively) to STI and WC.

    20221222_143723.jpg
    Last edited by Joelski; 24 December 2022 at 12:45.
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  8. #8
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    Had the manual on the left for many editions.
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  9. #9
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    Both are regarded as bibles. Kind of an "Old Testament" and a "Less Old Testament".

    My 1911 Maharishi has taught me a lot. One thing I've learned through the tedium of de-MIMing my Kimber is that a. those issues were years ago, and most of the internet hate is regurgitated crap from people who read more than do, and b. while you certainly can get a smoother action and lighter trigger pull, a lot of these newer tech-infused guns aren't bad. Tisas is a great example of that. I've seen die-hard mid-level guys get re-bitten by the bug with these decent, reasonably priced offerings. Bul is another one, and even Rich has said they're nice. Between those two, there are plenty of offerings for enthusiasts in all of the 1911 niches.

    Will these values dissuade me from owning a DW or Wilson? Probably not, but it certainly brings pride of ownership to affordable levels. Let the haters hate; I'll be enjoying my guns of all pedigrees.

    This gun has been upgraded with
    Ed Brown Slide Stop
    EGW Thumb Safety
    Harrison ignition kit, hammer and strut
    EGW mag catch
    Woodberry American Holly grips
    EGW Grip Safety to come
    Wilson Bullet Proof springs and pins
    Trigger pull is 3-1/2 # and scared the hell out of me the first time I lit it off. I have a G22 that's as touchy, thanks to a 3.5 lb connector, but damn, they are both crazy accurate guns! I never thought I'd hit black on white at 50 yds, let alone a ten ring on a range target (IDPA?)
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    Last edited by Joelski; 6 September 2023 at 15:58.
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  10. #10
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    Love the tuxedo look. You could have engraved next to the logo to show the less than acceptable issues have been rectified. Maybe - ďKimber PR (potential realized) or ďKimber FSE (factory shame expunged). I envy your patience and skilz. Nice piece.
    ď When I comes to modern politics, I think the inverse of Hanlon's Razor applies...In other words, "Never attribute to stupidity that which is adequately explained by malice." - Kerplode

  11. #11
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    But the thing I learned along the way is it probably only made a difference to my former mindset. After doing some learning, there arenít many guns that donít use MIM parts, chief of them is Springfield, but they can be found in higher end guns too. Truth is, some parts donít need to be made from tool steel like a slide stop does, but even then, a slide stop is a wear part, and needs to be replaced occasionally (if rarely). Over time, will the gun turn out to be better? Sure, thanks to bar stock, wear wonít eat into the softer core of the MIM parts just under the surface. Will I reach that milestone? Iíll probably never know now, more likely something I could have done better in my work will be exposed.

    Disclaimer, just noticed thatís an older pic showing the evil mim (shudder) thumb safety. Itís fixed, it Iíve bombarded enough.
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  12. #12
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    The ones doing the hating generally come from one of three groups:

    1. Their vast 1911 experiences comes from handling one but never owning or shooting a friend's gun.

    2. They run mouths more than guns.

    3. People who fall under the above who like to troll, claiming it's the internet as their excuse to be assholes. That's their excuse to do it, not a legitimate excuse.

    I've seen and read enough to learn that often enough it's those who've actually owned one to be the root cause of the these jams that I have yet to ever experience. I'll read on a reloading sub forum about clown shoes making mouse fart 45's and then read days later from the same clown shoes about how all his 1911's are jammers. Huh, feeding ammo that the gun wasn't designed for to run with and yet it's the gun and not the user or the user's ammo? Okay cheaper the keeper from boomerville.

    Or they'll use the slowest moving factory ammo that everyone knows is garbage. but because it's cheap they'll shoot with it and then blame the gun once again and not the user who should have known better. Okay scooter.

    Then we have clowns who think carbon is lube or that a modern designed gun doesn't need to be cleaned as much or often. Okay derpy-do.

    AND, we have bogans who will buy the cheapest ones with shoddy manufacturing, and then claims because their cheapest crap did a cheap crap expectancy, declares all of the same design to be choads. Okay herpy-do, derpy-do's inbred cousin.

    I've personally seen a dry dirty Glock 45 and a slick as a bone dirtied P10F have cycling issues. I've had my G17 not cycle because I had made a mistake during the reloading process for a batch of 124's. Sometimes they do cycle but not by much and are basically mouse farts; who would have thunk that even modern guns don't run on sub standard ammo too!!??

    Yes they are heavy but a well equipped modern polymer is going to be weighing the same or more. Plus it doesn't help that they're using walmart or target purchased belts to EDC along with their uncle mike's holsters also from wally world. And yes, their standard capacity is low to some who over analyze everything and project and fear monger their own fears into others about this topic, and more often leave their houses everyday without a spare mag (another user error and not the design's fAuLt). No matter what the capacity of something is, I would never EVER leave my house without a spare mag. Imagine having a type three malfunction and no spare mag to insert, meanwhile doing all of this while under life or death stress??? lol, NO. Just NO.

    I honestly DGAF why someone doesn't like it, but none of the above excuses are NOT legitimate when they themselves are the contributing factor of why their decisions make something sUcK. Just say that the 1911 isn't for you. I say Xd's are not for me and no juvenile quips about gRiP zOnE is necessary either to express myself. So say that the 1911 isn't for you. I'd have more respect for this person because they have integrity about it.

    Any way, I hope your Kimber reborn again, runs great. Give us a range report please when you can find the time to do so.
    Last edited by TheRifleman; 7 September 2023 at 07:10.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheRifleman View Post
    The ones doing the hating generally come from one of three groups:

    1. Their vast 1911 experiences comes from handling one but never owning or shooting a friend's gun.

    2. They run mouths more than guns.

    3. People who fall under the above who like to troll, claiming it's the internet as their excuse to be assholes. That's their excuse to do it, not a legitimate excuse.

    I've seen and read enough to learn that often enough it's those who've actually owned one to be the root cause of the these jams that I have yet to ever experience. I'll read on a reloading sub forum about clown shoes making mouse fart 45's and then read days later from the same clown shoes about how all his 1911's are jammers. Huh, feeding ammo that the gun wasn't designed for to run with and yet it's the gun and not the user or the user's ammo? Okay cheaper the keeper from boomerville.

    Or they'll use the slowest moving factory ammo that everyone knows is garbage. but because it's cheap they'll shoot with it and then blame the gun once again and not the user who should have known better. Okay scooter.

    Then we have clowns who think carbon is lube or that a modern designed gun doesn't need to be cleaned as much or often. Okay derpy-do.

    AND, we have bogans who will buy the cheapest ones with shoddy manufacturing, and then claims because their cheapest crap did a cheap crap expectancy, declares all of the same design to be choads. Okay herpy-do, derpy-do's inbred cousin.

    I've personally seen a dry dirty Glock 45 and a slick as a bone dirtied P10F have cycling issues. I've had my G17 not cycle because I had made a mistake during the reloading process for a batch of 124's. Sometimes they do cycle but not by much and are basically mouse farts; who would have thunk that even modern guns don't run on sub standard ammo too!!??

    Yes they are heavy but a well equipped modern polymer is going to be weighing the same or more. Plus it doesn't help that they're using walmart or target purchased belts to EDC along with their uncle mike's holsters also from wally world. And yes, their standard capacity is low to some who over analyze everything and project and fear monger their own fears into others about this topic, and more often leave their houses everyday without a spare mag (another user error and not the design's fAuLt). No matter what the capacity of something is, I would never EVER leave my house without a spare mag. Imagine having a type three malfunction and no spare mag to insert, meanwhile doing all of this while under life or death stress??? lol, NO. Just NO.

    I honestly DGAF why someone doesn't like it, but none of the above excuses are NOT legitimate when they themselves are the contributing factor of why their decisions make something sUcK. Just say that the 1911 isn't for you. I say Xd's are not for me and no juvenile quips about gRiP zOnE is necessary either to express myself. So say that the 1911 isn't for you. I'd have more respect for this person because they have integrity about it.

    Any way, I hope your Kimber reborn again, runs great. Give us a range report please when you can find the time to do so.
    ROFL!! Dude, you just explained the internet! Very well said and I couldn't agree more. I picked up a line on Yellowstone something like "Cheap shit ain't cool, and cool shit ain't cheap". That's kind of the mantra around here, being about evolved firearms, not so much in terms of dollars, so much as knowledge that can be gained and experiences that are legitimate to rely on. I don't think we cater to people who run excessively dirty guns outside of an experiment, nor the most value-conscious gear. The guys here are older, experienced and know what they like. I prize the things I've learned from guys like Rich and Jerry and 11Bravo. Sometimes it saves me a do-over, and usually I like the result. Think how nice the other forums would be if they didn't have the same spew from "My cousin's sister's husband" that happened 20 years ago and nobody had a similar experience, but their remote cusband did and "they all can go straight to hell!!!" The cancel culture wasn't created by millenials, it may have been perfected, but the inventors are fudds.
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  14. #14
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    For the record, I own a 1911 (Colt Competition) but do not carry it.

    Also for the record, I'd love to get a decent 1911 but in 9x19, with a light rail, and be optics capable. Not a 2011, a 1911.

    I just happen to prefer Glocks to my Sigs, HK VP9, and S&W M&P Shield. However I am not going to shit talk the things that are not for me, there's no reason to justify being an asshole. It's why I walked away willingly from both arf and M4C. The insufferableness was eating at me.

    And agreed, our own 2A community is our own worst enemies. Share the same goals and passions for the 2A? Nah, F that logic, let's eat each other and be divisive because so an so's like what I don't like. I know what friendly banter is, what they do isn't banter. I get roasted all the time from the wife, friends, and family. If they stopped, then they didn't like me anymore and that's a fact. These fools are not doing it because they like someone, they're doing it to shitpost and get rises from people, and to be tribal self elected chiefs to bully the rest of "their" community into lock, step, & heel.

    Anyway, 1911's do not deserve the hate that they're given. And IMO it's Americana and to hate on that is the equivalent of being a shitbag commie. I've seen guys with Glocks lose out to 1911's at matches. I've seen 1911's lose out to 2011's at shoot offs during classes. And I've seen 2011's lose out to surprisingly, VP9's doing either or duels. And then of course another brand that gets shit on goes ahead and smokes everyone else (CZ). None of the hate is warranted because look at the results in the hands of capable shooters (which all happen to not be 1911 haters, gee IMAGINE THAT).

  15. #15
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    Same here. I started with Glocks and never owned a wheel gun (Still don't), nor a 1911 until I reached my mid-50's. Something clicked, and I really dig it. I don't carry it, but plan to maybe in colder months. A 1911 is a gun that demands to be carried in a leather OWB holster; kydex need not apply. Of course, everything I write is my opinion, speaking strictly for myself. I can't stand the whole "Everything sucks unless it's exactly what I like/use". mentality. People don't make friends that way, for sure. I respect people at a social level that I was taught that was mannerly. My respect for people goes up when they display critical thinking, a willingness to share knowledge and accords mutual respect. Society is so lacking in friendliness. I can name off a bunch of guys on this forum that have lent me specialized tools, cut me deals, and one in particular who gifts some pretty nice stuff to members on a regular basis. That's a place worth hanging around, IMO. Do I wish it were busier? a little; I wouldn't want to mess up what we have here with people who aren't of a similar mindset to have a really nice place with really nice people and friendly conversation. Thanks for exactly that, and have a great evening!
    There's no "Team" in F**K YOU!

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