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  1. #1
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    An explanation from Young about staking their gas keys

    Here is a message from Daniel Young, president of Young MFG on why they do not stake their gas keys.
    Attached Files Attached Files

  2. #2
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    Interesting...

  3. #3
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    ???

    Wow! Confuses me at this point.

  4. #4
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    !!!!!!!

    *That* certainly runs contrary to everything I've ever read.

  5. #5
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    I'm curious to see some technical data regarding the likeliness of said screws backing out without any staking.

    -rebelEMPIRE

  6. #6
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    Doesn't Young chrome-plate every one of their carriers?
    WWW.TACTICALYELLOWVISOR.NET

  7. #7
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    Young also makes phosphate coated carriers.

  8. #8
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    My bet is that they started not staking them because they were chrome-plating them and there's no good way to do that. Plate before assembly and you crack the chrome doing it, plate after assembly and you wind up plating over a cold joint.

    If their glue method works for them and nobody is having them come loose then have at it. I see no reason not to stake a non-chrome key other than covering up the fact that you don't stake a chrome key because it's one of the weaknesses of having a chrome carrier.

    Of course, I'm one of those weirdos that's still trying to figure out just what it is that's wrong with my standard (staked, BTW) carrier and bolt with their standard finish, so maybe I'm not the best person to listen to on this.
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  9. #9
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    I believe they use a standard key so they could stake them if they want go.

    The way I see it is I seriously doubt that a company would put out that kind of information about THEIR product if it didn't work. The key I think is the torque value that they recommend and the adhesive.

    From personal experience, I have an old ass Bushmaster BCG that I used red loctite as recommended by Bushmaster and it has thousands of rounds through it with no issues. There's more that one way to do things that will still work. I personally don't stake the castle nut on my AR's, but I do place a couple of drops of Blue Loctite and they do not move. As long as it works and it is reliable, it is good to go.

  10. #10
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    Young is one of those companies where you never hear about problems. It doesn't mean that things don't slip out from time to time, but they have a very good reputation from everything I've ever heard.

    Much like Rob, most of my BCGs are park'd, but I do appreciate the easier cleaning aspects of a good BCG that is coated/ plated.

  11. #11
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    While I have never seen a Young key fail, I also see almost no Young carriers in guns to begin with, so statistically it's irrelevent.

    What I HAVE seen is locktited carrier key screws loose enough to allow gas-leakage and/or shear off. I have also seen castle nuts back off of guns with blue locktite underneath them.

    There is nothing wrong with doing something a different way if that different way is better, but most people seem to prefer different for the sake of different, or different out of obstinance whereby they stick to doing something wrong because to change would admit that they were doing it wrong.

    The idea of red loctite on the carrier key screws is very odd. That carrier is known to get a little warm, and heat breaks down red loctite.... Strikes me that rockset or the Young method would be better.

    Or you could just, you know, stake them like they should be to begin with.
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by rob_s View Post
    While I have never seen a Young key fail, I also see almost no Young carriers in guns to begin with, so statistically it's irrelevent.

    What I HAVE seen is locktited carrier key screws loose enough to allow gas-leakage and/or shear off. I have also seen castle nuts back off of guns with blue locktite underneath them.

    There is nothing wrong with doing something a different way if that different way is better, but most people seem to prefer different for the sake of different, or different out of obstinance whereby they stick to doing something wrong because to change would admit that they were doing it wrong.

    The idea of red loctite on the carrier key screws is very odd. That carrier is known to get a little warm, and heat breaks down red loctite.... Strikes me that rockset or the Young method would be better.

    Or you could just, you know, stake them like they should be to begin with.
    I was actually going to get one of the Michiguns Staking tools, but since the LMT Piston system doesn't have the gas key, it is not really necessary.
    If someone used blue loctite on the castle nut and it came loose, they did something wrong. I placed several drops on one and I had to cut that some-bitch off. Now, I just place one or two drops and it will hold. If I had the right equipment I would stake it just for the added security, but I don't have a vice, so I went with the blue loctite method.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by paulosantos View Post
    If I had the right equipment I would stake it just for the added security, but I don't have a vice, so I went with the blue loctite method.
    Paulo, a vice is not necessary.

    Lay the rear of the lower receiver on a block of wood (1X2) and using a modified screwdriver blade and hammer, stake the castle nut.

    Here’s a pic of my DIY staking tool.

    - Old flat-tip screwdriver blade, removed from the plastic handle.
    - Tip was ground down wider to produce a suitable stake indentation.
    - Refinished with G96 Cold Blue and lightly coated with CLP to protect the surface from rust during storage.


  14. #14
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    Quib, I might have to try that. My biggest problem was trying to keep the receiver from moving.

    On another note, the Young BCGs are more for precision type of ARs as they are designed with tighter tolerances. Even if they were properly staked, I don't think they would be using them for the type of shooting I do. Now if I had a Benchrest or Precision build, then I wouldn't mind having one of these.

  15. #15
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    Get a buddy to hold it, or get some wood and cut one to be the same fit to go into the bottom of the BCG opening and screw it into a bigger piece of wood so you can place the BCG on it and not roll too much. Just a thought. Never did it that way.. but never had the needed to stake a key either.

    Very interesting information from Young. I have one of their chrome national match BCG that has run a few thousand rounds without any issues. It practically looks new.

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