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  1. #1
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    Active shooter bag

    I'm new to LE and have been told that I should put together an active shooter bag. Does anyone have any recommendations on which bag I should look at or should I look into some type of vest?
    Semper Fi

  2. #2
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    Tactical bags like this are a bit like ladies purses: each of us is likely looking for something slightly different, and you have to take into account what it is that you really intend to carry. I suppose the "contents" issue is an implied part of the larger question here, but where the bag itself is concerned, I woud consider one of the following:


    The TaB from EGL which is an easy "first-choice" pick for me.

    The Eagle Patrol Bandoleer if all you're looking for is a "grab and go" means of securing some extra ammuntion (which is a bit more minimalist than most would recommend). If you need more than that, consider Eagle's "Active Shooter" bag, or for more carrying capability, their "E&E" bag. The latter is more flexible, but can also easily be overloaded if you're trying to keep things light.

    Can't really address the vest question, since I don't know what is/is not issued through your department; that said, Diamondback Tactical isn't a bad starting point if you're serious about exploring your rig options.

    AC

  3. #3
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    USMC,

    The first thing is obviously figuring out your department policies, and seeing what you are allowed to do.

    I break Active Shooter gear into a couple different schools of thought, as do many of the guys I work with.



    The first school of thought is under the simple and cheap method, and I won't say that this is bad, as its more than most will do. This idea bears in mind that you don't have to spend loads of money to be ahead of the curve. Shown below is a basic piece of imported gear. I don't push import stuff in general, and I won't push this, but the point is that it is better to have than not have. In this case, this thing is stitched decently, and is pretty heavy nylon. It might not hold up as well as something from Eagle, or Tactical Tailor, but remember, we are talking about being cheap in this first block.

    This thing has more than enough pockets to shove in a few magazines for whatever type of long gun system you carry. The end pockets are large, and can carry medical aid, 550 cord, lightsticks, cut down MREs, waterbottles, or whatever else you envision you may need. The upper pocket allows for a radio to be stored.

    The biggest selling point on this isn't that its going to carry the amount of magazines that I have pictures in it, the selling point is that its easy to store in your cruiser front seat, or trunk, easy to load gear into, and it runs around $30 or so. Again, this is getting into something as cheap as possible. A lot of us have MREs, extra mags, and basic first aid supplies laying around, or can get them through the department. This may not be the highest speed piece of kit in the arena, but it beats going into an active shooter scene without any gear.


  4. #4
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    The next idea is using a standard tac vest. This may limit the amount of medical supplies and additional gear you can carry, but its a quick way to carry extra ammo, and minimal supplies. Depending on the vest you grab, you can buy the versions that keep magazines on one side, and equipment on the other side. These are common, and bring you to the fight with a minimum of four mags for your weapon.

    I know that many have the idea that an Active Shooter scenario involves a shooter, or shooters that need to be put down or stopped quickly. I agree with this, and its standard teaching for instructors to harp on the fact that time saves lives. Various stats have been done up to show a shot is fired every "X" amount of seconds, the problem with stats is that they are done by guys who aren't going into harms way, and the stats are nothing more than numbers to them. Eight seconds in between rounds is one common number, but so are higher numbers, and its all a matter of who's info you are reading.

    What we also need to take into account is what our military brothers, already know. After the battle, we need to regroup, the scene needs to be secured, and we need to care for the wounded. When was the last time anyone worked a LACE report or equivalent into their LE shooting drills? LEO know that the fire department is going to be the first responder to give aid, but we also know that our large hatted friends aren't going to come into a facility that isn't secure, its against their policy. I'll make a brief announcement and comment that I hold nothing against firefighters, and have envy for anyone who can scam sleeping on duty and working 8 days a month, but we have to remember that this isn't their gig, its ours. While spend hours securing and searching a large school, mall, factory, or other complex, someone needs to do something for the casualties.

    My above does seem out of context, but there is a point. You are much more likely to give medical aid, than you are to go through 4 30 round mags, so consider that in your vest searching. Even if you are jaded, hate people, and refuse to consider the idea because you work a cesspool of district where you haven't deal with a "real" victim in 6 months, and work graveyard, what happens when the person who needs medical aid is your partner? Don't like your partner because he ratted you out to IAD? Fine, what about if you take rounds and need to stop your own bleeding ? The point is that there is more to some of these events than simply going in, shooting the bad guy, and having the state sing about you in their state song.

    Vests are great, and they can carry a wide variety of equipment. Think about what you might need before you make your purchase. Also consider if you want a vest that allows for modular pouches, or if you want one that is a one piece/ prebuilt unit.


    Here is my vest/ LBV.




    Last edited by Stickman; 10 January 2009 at 11:18.

  5. #5
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    The next way of getting into the gear is picking up a plate carrier (PC). The current PCs are often available to hold soft armor as well as plates, though there are obviously versions that will only carry plates.

    These tend to be more expensive, especially when you work the cost of armor into things. These allow for total customization, and you can look at any of the guys over in Afghanistan or Iraq to see examples of different configurations. Most Special Teams are using variants of Plate Carriers as well. If you have extra armor panels, plates, or access to plates, these are certainly worth looking into.

    I have a few PCs, and only have one with plates. The others are configured with soft armor, and setup however I feel like. Only one goes into harms way with me, and the times that I've needed to throw it on, I've been happy its there. This one is not a department issued item, and I prefer much of my own gear over what I'm issued.

    This method gives the greatest protection, and gives you the least maneuverability. Heavy Armor is heavy (oddly enough), and unless you train in it, you are going to find issues when you throw it on and expect to complete a tasking. Real world operations are not the time to suddenly figure out that your sling is too short, or your stock is too long, or that you set up your armor in a manner that you can't shoulder your carbine.

    Much like everything else, train ahead of time, and if at all possible, borrow equipment or talk to guys who have used the various gear before you make a purchase.


    I've got a few plate carrier images, the black one shows the back of my PC, the other shows my Eagle CIRAS in multicam. I'll see if I can't get some better pictures shot at some point.





    Last edited by Stickman; 10 January 2009 at 11:21.

  6. #6
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    I like the idea of using a plate carrier. I've checked out a few of the other officers gear in my depatment and have found that everyone uses something different. Nothing is issued and the only restriction I have right now is that I can only carry a shotgun (after one year I can qualify with my AR) so for now I dont have the need for mag pouches so I could use them to store my other gear. The plate carrirs are expensive but I think it would be money well spent.
    Semper Fi

  7. #7
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    While we all carry something different in type and manufacturer, let me throw out one thought and that which I also have done.

    I used to be resistant to the extra weight of the Redi-Mag, but once I got to thinking about it from a L/E patrol (active shooter) standpoint it makes perfect sense. If in the worst case scenario I need my rifle, but say I am rushed or under fire and the rifle is all I can grab, then at least with the Redi Mag I will have 60 rnds on board. If I am under fire, that 60 rnds should keep me alive long enough to suppress the threat so I can get whatever else I need including cover.

    I probably would never consider the Redi-Mag for long field combat patrols where I would already have the rest of my gear on, but for L/E patrol I think it is perfectly suited.
    "God made Cops, so Firemen could have Heroes."
    "We sleep safe in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm."

    Praise be to the LORD my Rock, who trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle. Psalm 144:1

  8. #8
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    I think that's exceptionally sound logic, Kirk. Yes, a Redi-Mag will add an initial training and manipulation "burden" to some degree, but it's a very reasonable investment to make for a LE scenario, as always having a reserve magazine on tap (without having to think about it, or remembering to grab anything extra) could well mean the difference between leaving the scene standing up, or God forbid, leaving it lying down.

    For military applications, you're right: we aren't permitted to get anywhere near the wire without donning our full kit, so spare mags just naturally go with the territory. For the LEO rolling into a chaotic situation at a shopping mall or university campus, a Redi-Mag could well prove to be a relatively inexpensive form of life insurance.

    AC

  9. #9
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    Stick brings up some excellent points!

    I carry a few different items which offer some versatility to whatever is needed.

    First, I keep a my 5.11 bailout bag, from GT distributing, with me. In it I carry (6) 30 round mags, (2) spare Glock mags, Surefire G2L, (2) flex cuffs, and my 5.11 medic pouch loaded with gear for basic trauma and gun shot wounds. I carry the bag slung across my shoulder and lays on my left side. By carrying it slung it dissipates the weight making it barely noticeable. It also keeps the bag off of my duty weapon should the need for a weapon transition be required. The bag is not overly big but just big enough! And the cost is just right. http://www.gtdist.com/ProductDetail....=511-56026-019

    Second, I keep my secondary tac vest with me. A Point Blank Dragon Fire. The vest is configured exactly like my full time SWAT vest.

    Another cheap alternative is the 5.11 chest rig. Very affordable, very light, and will allow you to carry (3) 30 round magazines. It is very minimal but like Stick already stated, having something is probably more than most of your fellow officers are doing. I know you stated that you are not allowed to carry a rifle yet but if you are certain that you will be deploying a long gun in the near future start building your kit. If you start now you will not be tasked with a huge $$$ bill. Buy a few things here and there when money is available. If you are only allowed to carry a shotgun then configure it to work for that weapon platform until you can transition over to a rifle.

    If you have any questions feel free to PM me. Be safe! Paul
    Adversity introduces us to ourselves

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  10. #10
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    Right now I am using a Eagle Industries Patrol Bandoleer for my rifle. I can carry 4 extra 30rnd mags for my AR and 2 for my handgun. I am looking to purchase a plate carrier similar to what Stickman showed as I just acquired a set up hard armor plates. I definitely want to add a medical kit to whatever setup I end up with.

  11. #11
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    Having been through one 8hr class of a three part active shooter block of instruction, dealing with patterns of movement, tactical "L", systematic searches, setting up a command post, etc...
    Aside from the type of "carrier" is there a list of items one should consider for their "bag"?
    obviously extra ammo/mags for what ever weapon system the dept. policy authorizes. maybe something to mark rooms that are clear or that have been searched, a trauma/med kit, extra light/batteries, flex cuffs, ??????
    what else should one consider?

    ETA: this would be for the average patrolman, 1st on scene units as SWAT would be 30-45mins out if not longer.

  12. #12
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    WATER!!!!

    Once it is all over, you will quickly find you are tied up with so much drama you may not be able to get back to your unit and lunch pail. After all that running, sweating and heavy breathing you WILL be dehidrated, and in that state you will not be able to think as clearly.

    19 years of experience has taught me to carry at least one new unopened bottle of water in my "bail out" bag, and maybe a second for my partner who didnt plan ahead.

    Water also has the uncanny ability to lift the human spirit.

    Ok... no more beating the dead horse.
    "God made Cops, so Firemen could have Heroes."
    "We sleep safe in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm."

    Praise be to the LORD my Rock, who trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle. Psalm 144:1

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by CAPT KIRK View Post
    WATER!!!! ... and maybe a second for my partner who didnt plan ahead.
    A valid observation if there ever was one. Often, you're not only having to look out for yourself, but also for the guy to your left or right that didn't arrive with the same level of preparedness -- and often, that isn't entirely his fault, depending upon when/how/under what circumstances he joined the scene.

    Even on the military side, where we're working with a much more standardized set of kit requirements, these things can, and do happen. Space and weight permitting, a wise man will consider this when building his basic load, whether we're talking about ammunition, Scooby snacks, First Aid items, etc. Sooner or later, you're likely to be faced with the choice between halving your supply of item-x, or coming off as a selfish prick; if you're in this business to begin with, you know that the latter isn't really a valid option.

    AC

  14. #14
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    Also...... oh so simple most might overlook it. Your head is the biggest tranducer of body heat, going out in the cold and coming in during the heat.

    Dont be without a ..... HAT.
    "God made Cops, so Firemen could have Heroes."
    "We sleep safe in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm."

    Praise be to the LORD my Rock, who trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle. Psalm 144:1

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