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  1. #1
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    Red Dot/Holographic Site discussion

    I went to a gun show today so that I could fondle some of the goods. While I was there, among other things I was able to play with a Trijicon SRS. Admittedly I have to say I have sort of been predisposed to that one but not for any particular reason other than I think it would be good. That said I know a few people are not that keen on them for one reason or another.

    Before I start forking out dough on building an SBR I want to have the whole thing thought out and obviously an optic is a big part of that. For one reason or another I don't like buying a bunch of stuff on a half thought out concept.

    That said my current criteria are as follows:

    I want something nice. That said I don't see any reason to over pay for something that honestly won't be (for me) anything more than just bragging rights. Crap optics are not not on my agenda. I would rather save and get what I really want.

    I want a 1x.

    I will probably run my (future) SBR with flip up irons as back up.

    Initially I really did not like (at all) QD mounted anything. That said I recently changed my mind entirely on that. I recently bought an Atlas bipod that has an ADM QD attach. That thing is just beautiful. The mount on it is a piece of art if you ask me. Long story short if it has a good QD mount that will be fine. It would be a good option to have.

    All that said, once I mount the optic, odds are I won't be moving it around or taking it off or whatever, but a good QD mount would be an option to consider.

    I know there are other kinds of mounts. Some are taller. Some are shorter. Honestly I don't quite know the pros and cons of each style and what are their benefits.

    In my mind I am wanting an optic that has a wide objective. I am guessing this would give me a both eyes open/better peripheral vision. I don't want to lose the dot if you know what I mean. I want to effortlessly look through it. That is a high priority.

    Other random thoughts are below:

    I probably will never buy or use a magnifier for the SBR. Maybe after I get some more SBR running under my belt but I doubt it. I am building the gun to be 100yards and in minute of man. Anything else is just gravy. For this gun speed and ease on target is more important than tiny 1 MOA dots.

    I would want my optic to be daylight bright if that's possible.

    Maybe some sort of cowitnessing would be a plus, but if someone can tell me the benefits of taller (or different style) mounts then that's even better. This is one of the things I want to figure out. I don't know if I want to pop the optic off via QD or set up a cowitness setup.

    I am not at all married to any kind, type, or brand of optic. I don't care if it's holographic or red dot. The 1x concept and options are what I am after.

    My gun will primarily be a range toy and maybe for home defense, or in a pinch to possibly to give an attitude adjustment to zombies or looters. Overall I am not trying to scrimp on parts but what I buy has to add value to justify it's cost. I will have the rifle for 20 years so no crap.

    Things like keeping a few spare batteries on hand isn't that big of an issue but admittedly I kind of like not having to worry about batteries.

    Is there anything else I should know? Lay it all out here fellas. Teach me something.

  2. #2
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    A decent reflex sight might be what word work best with your criteria. They are 1X with unlimited eye relief. The battery life is generally in the thousands hours range. So, having a spare on inside the grip is fine. It would be years down the road when it would need changing. Very good ones can be bought made by both Trijicon and Aimpoint. The Vortex Razor would be at the lower end of the better quality spectrum at around $400. The Trijicon RMR comes in various models in the 500+ range, so is the Leupold DeltaPoint Pro. Eotechs fall in that range also.

    To co-witness with them you add a mount to them that brings it up to the height you want to for co-witnessing.

    Other than that, you go with red dot sights with a tube housing. Vortex would be the least expensive decent quality option though I have heard good stuff about the sights that Primary Arms offers. I'm planning on one of the Primary Arms red dots for my next rifle. I have the Vortex Strikefire II on my piston rifle.

    There are a lot of options available. I probably wouldn't bother with a QD mount though if I was planning on leaving the sight on the rifle anyway and co-witnessing it. Using the iron sights just sights through the glass anyway and there's no magnification.
    Freedom is NEVER Free. We have to work to protect it and even be willing to die to protect it.

  3. #3
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    Here is the concept so far on my (concept) for my SBR build.

    -CMT Gen 2 Lower (not the ambi one)
    -CMT Slick Side upper with no dust cover
    -SLR Solo Lite Mlok rail (I think maybe the 10 or 11 inch, whichever one fits better)
    -SLR adjustable gas block (pinned)
    -12.5" AR Performance 5.56 barrel (1/8 twist) (I keep debating between an 11.5 and a 12.5)
    -Griffin Flash Comp Taper Mount
    -SNACH charging handle
    -CMC 3.5 single stage flat trigger
    -stock is TBD
    -irons and optic TBD

  4. #4
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    You could go with one of the Adcor Defense bolt carriers with the integrated dust wiper since you're going with a slick side upper.
    Freedom is NEVER Free. We have to work to protect it and even be willing to die to protect it.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by WHSmithIV View Post
    You could go with one of the Adcor Defense bolt carriers with the integrated dust wiper since you're going with a slick side upper.
    I will cross that bridge when I get to it

    Absolutely nothing is etched in stone but that is the concept that I keep coming back to.

    Once I make the decision to build it I will just go on a buying spree.

  6. #6
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    Sounds like an Aimpoint Micro (or pro) is calling your name.
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by VIPER 237 View Post
    Sounds like an Aimpoint Micro (or pro) is calling your name.
    I was going to say the same. A Scalarworks mount with a Micro would suit you well. As far as a barrel I reccomend the 12.5" as he makes his barrels longer than a true 12.5" so you can accomidate a 12" rail. This is why i can run a 12" fortis rev rail on my 12.5" SBR. I'd also reccomend a MFT Minimalist stock.. there is a reason I have 5 of them....
    Last edited by Dstrbdmedic167; 12 September 2015 at 20:56.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dstrbdmedic167 View Post
    As far as a barrel I reccomend the 12.5" as he makes his barrels longer than a true 12.5" so you can accomidate a 12" rail. This is why i can run a 12" fortis rev rail on my 12.5" SBR.

    The exact reason for that choice.

    I also keep going back and forth between an 11.5 and a 12.5 though. I am not sure if it will make any real difference. Probably not for my purposes...
    Last edited by Dstrbdmedic167; 12 September 2015 at 20:57.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by alamo5000 View Post
    The exact reason for that choice.

    I also keep going back and forth between an 11.5 and a 12.5 though. I am not sure if it will make any real difference. Probably not for my purposes...
    Difference is minimal... Choose your preferred length and either way you'll be satisfied...

  10. #10
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    I think once the "newness" of my 12.5 upper build subsidies, we'll end up shooting the 11.5 more. Not a lot of difference though practically

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by DutyUse View Post
    I think once the "newness" of my 12.5 upper build subsidies, we'll end up shooting the 11.5 more. Not a lot of difference though practically
    Why you say that? Before I spend I want to know :)

  12. #12
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    Our 12.5 is running a NSR, while the 11.5 is running a KMR. The 12.5 handles beautifully and I certainly could live with it being my only rifle.. But the 11.5 as we have it configured is just that much more handy. And then when I finally decide on which can to run it'll be that much more compact.

    Either way is a win. To really throw a monkey wrench in the mix though, I'm really loving the 10.5 we did a while back as well

  13. #13
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    I went from 10.3 to 14.5 pinned guns.

    That said, comp m4 or T2 would be the primo choices, and PRO and H1 would be the budget choices. Bobro or scalarworks for the mounts.

  14. #14
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    My 12.5" upper has an Aimpoint T1 micro (mine is a 2 moa dot, 4 moa dot is available) in an ADM lower 1/3 cowitness QD mount (model AD-T1-11), and i run Troy flip up BUIS. Aimpoint micros are the gold standard as far as i'm concerned for a multitude of reasons, and it fits the bill for shooting both eyes open and fast and easy dot/target acquisition. And with the small size of the Aimpoint micros, the optic doesn't "block your view" so to speak. I love ADM mounts for their durability and ease of use, and have a variety of optics mounted in them. Return to zero is pretty consistent and most times no, or very little, adjustment is required. I prefer the lower 1/3 cowitness as it puts the optic slightly higher off the receiver, and makes for a more comfortable and natural (for me) cheek weld. And if you're running a gun with a A2 style FSB (or just happen to have your BUIS flipped up), lower 1/3 puts the BUIS in the bottom of the glass so you have an unobstructed view of the dot. The next time i buy an Aimpoint micro, i think i'm going to try a Bobro mount, as i've read nothing but good things about them.
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  15. #15
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    I like your parts list except I don't understand why you selected the CMT receivers when you also state "I don't see any reason to over pay for something that honestly won't be (for me) anything more than just bragging rights." IMO, billet adds cost w/o increasing functionality. Good ambi features are about the only reason why I'd even consider going billet over forged, but there are some good ambi forged sets out there.

    If you don't have a front sight tower, then I'd stick with "standard" co-witness height. If you do have a front sight tower, then consider lower 1/3.

    I run a PA micro, which is the $80 imitation of the Aimpoint micros and I really like it. The PA would be an inexpensive way for you to test the waters. I would like to try running a Vortex Strikefire, though, as the tube is larger and I think may be "faster" (and of course I extrapolate that to the Aimpoint PRO). I think that is part of the reason the PROs and Comp M4s are so popular). However, I do plan on going with an EOTech for my go-to carbine as I really like the reticle and huge FOV of the holographic and I'm not that concerned about battery life (it will be run in lower 1/3 cw on a carbine with fixed sights, so if the battery dies I'm still up)

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