Trying to decide on a new scope

[gatordev]

At least quote my whole post, where I basically say it's personal preference. :)

Edit: I also didn't say it wasn't useful, or that the reticle is too small at 5x. I said it's too small at 2.5x (for me).

Sorry, at the end of the day, I guess we're saying the same thing. I know you have mentioned in the past of not finding value in a FFP 2.5-10 (for you), so I may have also been replying to that a bit. For the record, I find 2.5 to be way too small to use the reticule as well, but I also can't think of a reason why I would be at that low of a mag and also be engaging far enough out where I would need the reticule. For me, I'd just spin in the dope for a 300m zero and use Point Blank Range, otherwise I'd up the mag to 4 or 5 and start using the reticule.

But as we're both saying, it's all going to depend on how one wants to use their weapon.

[Former11B]

yeah, no problem at all on the steel at 450 with the acog, I might really check out the nightforce 2.5x10 and maybe look at the nightforce 1x4 also, at the moment really thinking this gun is gonna be used mostly for 100 out to 600 meters.

If you're planning on shooting 0-600, I'd say the 2.5-10x32 would be a great choice. I'm partial to that magnification range anyhow, and I also have a 3.5x TA11-J ACOG. Going from essentially a fixed 4 power to a 1-6x is going to be a very small improvement, one that is not worth the investment, IMO.

I will echo Slipper's statement that the 2.5-10x32 FFP reticle on the Vortex is very thin (recently got one), so if that's not suitable for you, maybe the 2.5-10x NightForce is the better choice, however, I'm not sure if the reticle on the NF is going to be noticeably thicker. This is when kicking the tires in a local shop that carries quality gear pays off.

[alamo5000]

That kind of queers the deal though. It's like telling someone to drive a Porsche 944 and a Ferrari Testarossa so they can decide on whether or not they want the new gt3 or an f458. It's just that the quality and results vary so much from a cheap 1-4 to a quality 1-4 that it renders the trial moot.

Yes of course they will be different in many ways but for the price of one night force he can get two vortex and have money left over. Which at this stage could be a potential shorter term fix. All I'm saying is to get some sort of experience in the optic categories he's looking at so he can form his own opinion. In the mean time there can be a lot of great shooting going on. At least for me using a middle of the road optic does not depreciate my value for higher end stuff. In fact for me it has enhanced it. Not all that long ago I was in his same boat to some degree, but now if I walk into a gun shop and kick the tires of some high dollar stuff it means more to me now than it did then.

It's not a fix all. Just one person's opinion.

[ducrider14]

think I might try to find some 2.5x 10 scopes to look through, that might be the scope for this one, just gotta find a place that has a few in stock, probably gonna make my way up to cabelas in the next week or two. I would like to stretch this one out a little more. there are so many variables and preferences that this might take a bit of time, i have a friend that can get me good deals on leupold so I might check them out along with nightforce and steiner and a couple others that are somewhat similar price wise

[JGifford]

think I might try to find some 2.5x 10 scopes to look through, that might be the scope for this one, just gotta find a place that has a few in stock, probably gonna make my way up to cabelas in the next week or two. I would like to stretch this one out a little more. there are so many variables and preferences that this might take a bit of time, i have a friend that can get me good deals on leupold so I might check them out along with nightforce and steiner and a couple others that are somewhat similar price wise

Steiner's 1-4X is currently a stoopid good deal at $699.

[Former11B]

Steiner's 1-4X is currently a stoopid good deal at $699.

I just don't see the benefit of going from a 3.5x ACOG (amazingly clear glass...at least mine is, as well as extremely precise) to a variable power optics with nearly the same maximum power setting. Unless you're just putting this out there as a general recommendation to anyone in the market. In which case, my apologies.

[alamo5000]

My opinion is no matter what you get you're going to want something new eventually

For me I started out with one set of tastes but my pallet has developed more over time.

Getting the right product match up to your individual needs and wants takes time and often you might discover things you thought you liked but don't or vice versa.

[DeviantLogic]

Using a nightforce unimount or kac, and a torque wrench produces very very very good rtz, involves less weight, and is a more stable attachment method imo

I agree, and that's why I run the NF mounts on my bolt guns...but I also don't swap them around but once in a blue moon, maybe cause I don't keep a torque wrench in my range bag. The Larue QD mounts have a pretty darn good return to zero in my opinion, and they get taken on/off on a pretty regular basis...couple times a month at least.

Speaking of torque wrenches...been thinking of getting a couple of these guys to take along in my range bag...fix it sticks torque limiters. New product I read about on sniper's hide.

[ducrider14]

I just don't see the benefit of going from a 3.5x ACOG (amazingly clear glass...at least mine is, as well as extremely precise) to a variable power optics with nearly the same maximum power setting. Unless you're just putting this out there as a general recommendation to anyone in the market. In which case, my apologies.

That's what I am thinking, I'm gonna go higher magnification, it's not worth going to a 1x4 from the acog, I love the acog, no batteries, and indestructible, but will go 2.5x10 on the scope

[BoilerUp]

Speaking of torque wrenches...been thinking of getting a couple of these guys to take along in my range bag...fix it sticks torque limiters. New product I read about on sniper's hide.

Cheaper and more versatile to just pick up one of these: http://www.amazon.com/PERFORMANCE-TO...+torque+wrench

[SINNER]

Not a fan of beam type torque Wrenches especially when measuring in inch/lbs. I would go with a torque driver style.


High end.

https://store.snapon.com/Adjustable-...e-P744932.aspx

Budget but very functional.

http://www.btibrands.com/product/fat...t/?mobile=true

[BoilerUp]

Not a fan of beam type torque Wrenches especially when measuring in inch/lbs. I would go with a torque driver style.

Interesting. Why? I'm the opposite. Beam style wrenches give you a continuous readout, pretty much never loose calibration (and are simple to re-calibrate), don't have to be re-set back to 0 for storage, have essentially no moving parts to break, and to top it all off they are cheaper. If I worked with the tools professionally in a shop that calibrated them on a regular basis, I'm sure I'd prefer the driver style, but for a DIY-er on a budget I think beam-style is the better option.

[ducrider14]

So what are everyone's preferences, ffp/sfp? Looks like most 2.5x10's are second, and is it hard to get used to, usually I just use my acog and use the bdc, it's pretty simple, not much to mess up, but I don't want to get the wrong scope and try to figure out holdovers and hate it after spending a couple grand, like I said I really appreciate the help and information, no one has really taught me any of this, I just kind of got into firearms a few years ago by myself
Josh

[DeviantLogic]

Cheaper and more versatile to just pick up one of these: http://www.amazon.com/PERFORMANCE-TO...+torque+wrench

Yeah...I'm not going to lug a torque wrench like that in my range bag anytime soon. I've got torque wrenches, but normally use a wheeler fat wrench (screwdriver type) for torquing the cross bolts. I was looking at the fix-it stick torque limiters and the borka torque drivers as an option to carry in the range bag. Lightweight and don't take up much space.

[DeviantLogic]

So what are everyone's preferences, ffp/sfp? Looks like most 2.5x10's are second, and is it hard to get used to, usually I just use my acog and use the bdc, it's pretty simple, not much to mess up, but I don't want to get the wrong scope and try to figure out holdovers and hate it after spending a couple grand, like I said I really appreciate the help and information, no one has really taught me any of this, I just kind of got into firearms a few years ago by myself
Josh

Might want to check out this explanation on the differences between first focal plane and second focal plane scopes: http://www.primalrights.com/articles...t-3-sfp-vs-ffp.

I honestly prefer a first focal plane scope. No math for adjustments...what you see in the glass is what you dial on the turrets. It makes for (mostly) accurate distance estimations without a rangefinder. The problem is that the benefits you get with a FFP are largely diminished when you get into lower magnifications. At lower magnifications, the reticle gets smaller, the lines appear thinner, and it becomes difficult to see tick marks. Where this trade off occurs kind of depends on the shooter's eyes and the glass. Regardless, first focal plane scopes really shine with higher magnifications.