View Poll Results: Rifle Choice

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  • BCM HSP Jack Carbine

    8 57.14%
  • DDM4 V11 SLW

    5 35.71%
  • Spikes Black Assassin

    1 7.14%
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  1. #1
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    14.5 complete rifle... bcm/DD/spikes?

    I am currently in the market for a complete*rifle. Something name brand, history of good weapon systems, reliable and most of all a warranty. I own several AR15s, mostly builds of my own but I'm looking to get into some shooting classes and I want something reliable and dependable for that as well as defense.*
    I'm selling my old M1A and a converted saiga to cut down on so many different systems and ammos. Anyway, long story short, 3 rifles have caught my attention.*

    Desired specs:*
    Free float*
    14.5 barrel (preferably govt profile as I'm unsure of LW)*
    Mid gas
    Decent trigger*
    Flat top (no fixed sights)*
    Reliable and vetted system*
    Pricing around 2k is acceptable*
    DI gas*
    Pinned brake*
    Customer service (in case)*


    Spikes Tactical: (Black Assassin)*
    http://www.spikestactical.com/st-bla...al-p-918.html*

    Daniel Defense: (DDM4 V11 slw)*
    https://danieldefense.com/firearms/m...q3r5kbslh02h2*

    BCM: (HSP Jack Carbine)*
    http://www.bravocompanymfg.com/TheJack/*

    I cannot find any reasoning in which*rifle*to choose over any other*rifle. All companies seem to have their followers and all seem to have excellent reviews. Just trying to get some input on which direction to go.*

    Thanks.

  2. #2
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    BCM followed closely by DD.

  3. #3
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    ^^Agreed. Between these two, get whichever you are less likely to change the stock & grip on.
    Ground Defense 1, Blade Defense 1, Defensive Pistol 1 & 2, Aliance Shoot House, When Things Go Bad, YSINTG, Carbine 1, DART Medical, NRA Range Safety Officer
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  4. #4
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    Thanks for the info so far... On the DD rifles the 14.5s seem to only come in LW profiles... Personally I've never had thinner than govt. Any input on the LW profiles? Considering I'm wanting to use it for a defensive carbine and maybe a few other courses containing sustained fire. Wasn't sure how they behave.

  5. #5
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    How did Spikes get on the same list with BCM and DD?

    I vote for the BCM Recce Keymod KMR: http://www.bravocompanymfg.com/carbi...cce_keymod.php

    but DD is a close second.

    You might want to consider LaRue, too: http://www.laruetactical.com/larue-t...-predatobr-556

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoilerUp View Post
    How did Spikes get on the same list with BCM and DD?

    I vote for the BCM Recce Keymod KMR: http://www.bravocompanymfg.com/carbi...cce_keymod.php

    but DD is a close second.

    You might want to consider LaRue, too: http://www.laruetactical.com/larue-t...-predatobr-556
    Good eye on that BCM rifle, looks to be close to what I want. I'll look a bit more into it. The Jack grabbed my attention with the cerakote, Geissele rail and sights. Plus the training coupon if I managed to utilize it.

    Some other forums I follow seem to love the spikes coolaid. Swearing they are just as good or better as any top brands. Again, I don't own one. The NiB bolts and CHF barrels caught my attention.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoilerUp View Post

    I vote for the BCM Recce Keymod KMR: http://www.bravocompanymfg.com/carbi...cce_keymod.php
    +1. For the price I really like the bcm recce's

  8. #8
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    My money would go to BCM also but I wouldn't go with the Jack. It's a nice looking rifle but to me the price point for what it is just doesn't seem worth it. The link for the BCM rifle BoilerUp posted would be my choice. I have a BCM 14.5" upper and it's been golden. Rebel Arms I think makes a 14.5 and I've heard good things on them as well.
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Farva View Post
    My money would go to BCM also but I wouldn't go with the Jack. It's a nice looking rifle but to me the price point for what it is just doesn't seem worth it. The link for the BCM rifle BoilerUp posted would be my choice. I have a BCM 14.5" upper and it's been golden. Rebel Arms I think makes a 14.5 and I've heard good things on them as well.
    I too, personally would choose a different BCM than the Jack. And actually between the Jack the DD posted I'd probably choose the DD after looking at them some more.
    Ground Defense 1, Blade Defense 1, Defensive Pistol 1 & 2, Aliance Shoot House, When Things Go Bad, YSINTG, Carbine 1, DART Medical, NRA Range Safety Officer
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  10. #10
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    Nothing really wrong with Spikes, but I'd never pay a premium price for one. That looks like a $900 gun to me.

    I personally really like the configuration of that BCM Recce Keymod. The only thing I would even think about switching out is the trigger group and muzzle device. To preserve that flexibility, I would recommend you go with a 16" over a 14.5". Not that you can't change out a pinned/welded muzzle device, but it's obviously harder.

    The Recce has a BCM SS barrel whereas the Jack appears to have a standard mil-spec barrel. I'm surprised it doesn't have the CHF BCM barrel. I don't think BCM even offers their SS barrel in 14.5" separately. Those BCM SS barrels have a rep for excellent accuracy. The ALG is only a $45 trigger and one I'd likely still end up replacing. The Geissele hand guard is good. For the Jack, you're paying extra for the cerakote, the weapon light, and for Haley's logo which I'd probably put duct tape over anyway.

    I'm a big fan of the BCM Gunfighter accessories, too, so I love the pistol grip. I don't have the stock yet but will be using one on my next build just because I know BCM really thinks through their designs. I do have a B5 Sopmod (like is on the Jack) and those are very good stocks - great cheek weld. And I like the Gunfighter Charging handles.

    I think many on this forum support the view that the BCM BCG is the gold standard. Daniel Defense, IMO, hangs right there with them, though.

    Note that there is a Light Weight version of the KeyMod Recce that uses the KMR made from the lighter weight alloy instead of the KMR-Alpha which is Aluminum.

    Also, I think BCM recently changed their naming/branding of the Recce series. The Recce with the SS barrel used to be the "Recce KMR Precision" http://www.rainierarms.com/rifle-bcm...-kmr-precision

    That DD V11 is a quality rifle. I'm not a big fan of the DD pistol grip/stock, so there is $80 I'd spend. I'm also less than thrilled with DD handguards. I think they've fallen behind in innovation here. The SLIM rail on the v11 looks pretty good, though. Might want to consider the base V11 so you get the standard profile barrel if you don't want a LW barrel. https://danieldefense.com/firearms/m...rbine-v11.html

    IMO, the barrel should be one of the driving factors for your decision. I wouldn't buy a gun where I felt I'd need/want to swap out the barrel. Of the 3 you listed, only the DD has what I consider to be a premium barrel, but in a LW profile. After that, it's like Pyzik says, buy the one with the fewest/cheapest parts you'll be swapping.

  11. #11
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    I think it's been covered several times already, I would go with the BCM, but not the Jack, unless you really want the disruptive gray cerakote or you're Centerfire14.

    Seriously, I'd go with a Blem BCM Cosmo Lower to save some cash.

    Then get a factory BCM upper of your choice. I've got a 14.5" Midlength KMR upper with a pinned BCM Comp that I'd recommend if you're set on 14.5"

  12. #12
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    RECCE seems to be the hot ticket right now (resists urge to post pic... Ergh!). I will say definitely check out the 14.5" BCM RECCE. No matter which one you pick, you gotta look at it more than you shoot it; the new DD furniture is nauseating, IMO. Anyway, check out the mid-length gas; it makes the rifle handle smoother and IMO, eliminates the buffer fiddling unless you're into that sort of thing.
    There's no "Team" in F**K YOU!

  13. #13
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    For the record, this forum is miles above arf... Lol no one wants to actually talk about the useful info.

    Anyways, I'm looking at the recce in 14.5. Watching videos etc.
    My reasoning is my most fired ar15 is a Barrett Rec7 through my job. I like the geiselle trigger it has, but I'd never buy one. For some reason the Jack reminds me of it. On 2 of my last builds I used the ALG and they are very predictable. Although it's a bit heavy. But in a tense environment (competition, hunting, etc) you don't notice the ALG weight.

    The DD rifles would require me to do a custom build for the setup I want. But seeing the SS barrel on the Recce I think I've fallen in love... Plus I can get like 1500-2000 rounds with the money saved over the Jack...

    EDIT: looks like the 14.5 barrels are not SS, only the 16 and 18 inch "precision" models. Still fits what I need though.
    Last edited by hkdcamcain; 22 November 2015 at 14:50.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoilerUp View Post
    How did Spikes get on the same list with BCM and DD?

    I vote for the BCM Recce Keymod KMR: http://www.bravocompanymfg.com/carbi...cce_keymod.php

    but DD is a close second.

    You might want to consider LaRue, too: http://www.laruetactical.com/larue-t...-predatobr-556
    lol, gonna hurt Luis' feelings talking about Spikes like that


    I'm not a fan of MLOK but Daniel Defense, I would say, makes better rails and mounting methods than a lot of places out there. Very firm, very solid, and better than quite a few of the OEM/in house offerings by some top shelf names

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joelski View Post
    RECCE seems to be the hot ticket right now (resists urge to post pic... Ergh!). I will say definitely check out the 14.5" BCM RECCE. No matter which one you pick, you gotta look at it more than you shoot it; the new DD furniture is nauseating, IMO. Anyway, check out the mid-length gas; it makes the rifle handle smoother and IMO, eliminates the buffer fiddling unless you're into that sort of thing.
    As somewhat odd looking as the DD furniture is its grippy as hell! I fondled one of my LT's rifle that has it on it and it almost won't let go of you.
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