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  1. #1
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    Less typing, more shooting (training discussion)

    Figured I'd start a thread on various techniques/drills that people use for their respective shooting disciplines. Molon's excellent "Quarter" of MOA is an example, but thought a one-stop thread might be a good idea...

    The last few months that I've competed in the local 2 gun match, I've found I've started slowing down. While there's lots of gamers who spray more rounds faster and take the penalties but end up with faster times, I prefer to focus on shot placement with the minimal time necessary. I also pride myself in understanding that we're shooting rifles, so doing everything at 25 yards and in, while an important (and fun) skill, shouldn't be the standard and one should be able to engage targets out to 200m with a RDS. Basically my issue has been that I still place in the top 20, but I can see my inefficiencies slowing me down. So this weekend, a shooting buddy and I (and a couple of others) went out and worked some specific drills that were great training.

    DISCLAIMER: I'm not saying these are original drills. I'm sure they're someone's creation before we did them today, but they were some good ways to focus on specific portions of shooting a rifle accurately AND quickly.

    What we ran yesterday basically boiled down to needing either a 50m x 25-ish m bay or if you can, a 100m x 25-ish m bay. The range I shoot at is a playground, so I'm lucky to have access to various shapes and sizes. With some alterations along the way, we did two primary drills using close up and distance shots.

    Drill 1:

    2 (or 3) targets. One paper target and 1 (or 2) steel targets at distance. Set the paper target up close (something inside 10m that requires you to use your holds for off-set). We used a Caldwell 4-target sticky target, with each target being about 3-4" (as seen here). The steel was set up at approx. 70m in line with the shooter, but 90 degrees out from the paper target. This forces you to turn and acquire the steel at distance.

    Depending on how much ammo you want to burn (and I'm a fan of making each shot count and not just blowing through as much as you can shoot), you can decide if you want to engage all 4 targets or just two of the targets. We chose to shoot all 4, with 2 shots on each bulls eye and then 2 shots on the steel at distance. At one point we put another steel target at an intermediate distance, as well, but that was to mix it up. The goal is to get all 8 rounds inside the rings of the paper targets and then (obviously) not miss the steel with 2 shots. Each miss was 1 second. This works well as a nice static drill. Total round count is 10 (or 12 if you use a second steel target).

    Drill 2:

    I'm a big fan of NOT being one of the large and in-charge internet commandos at the range that just sits at their bench and blasts away. I really enjoy getting the heart rate up and shooting because it gets much more challenging and teaches you how you probably shouldn't have skipped that run the other day that you know you should have done. So this drill requires 2 steel targets in a 50m x 25m bay and the ability to move around the bay.

    Basically think of this as four corners. The two steel targets are at the far two corners and you start inline with one steel target at about 50m. The drill is that you engage the target in front of you with 2 (or whatever) shots, then run (yes, run!) laterally to be inline with the second steel target, again at 50-ish meters. Take two more shots, then run forward towards that same target. Run up to however close you feel comfortable with shooting steel and stop. Take two shots. Then run laterally over to the first target and 2 more shots. Then run back towards the starting point and engage the first target again with 2 more shots. Now do it all again for another lap. Total round count is 20. We found a realistic par time to be around 50-55 seconds.

    By the second lap, this is a pretty good workout and you do get tired. You'll need to determine what is safe when it comes to running back from the target to the starting point. Personally, I still keep the rifle pointed down range as I run back (but I don't run backwards, if that makes sense). Regardless, this is definitely an opportunity to practice the 180 rule.

    So, what do you do?

  2. #2
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    Although I am not in any 2 or 3 gun competitions yet, but I began from never owning an AR before to hopefully being able at some point to run some courses or compete at some amateur level.

    I think the basis for everything (at least for me) is having a basic and real understanding of the platform you're using. Is it accurate, and if so, how accurate, and at how far? That and many other questions need to be answered. You need to know your rifle, your scope, your red dot, or whatever. I've taken a lot of time to work up a load and a lot of time to get my rifle on zero among several other aspects. Once you know what your gear is capable of then it all falls back on to you as the shooter.

    My approach has been a scientific approach. I don't want to be a one trick pony but knowing the fundamentals of stuff matters. For my rifle if I know without batting an eye that I need 20.5 MOA holdover to hit a 600 yard target... and on and on... 300, 375, 450, 550 yards... and so on...that stuff is vital information. I am more or less trying to pack information into my head through experience.

    I personally don't want to be a dumbass with a gun, I want to be knowledgeable. The more (specific) information you have about everything the better. Your rounds. Your scope. Your trigger. Your barrel. Knowing your stuff matters. There is a whole lot of BS floating around the internet so sifting through and finding the nuggets of truth matters a lot.

    It doesn't feel like I am 'training' but in reality I am.

    Then once I take that know how... that 'raw data'... then hopefully I can translate that into 'second nature' drills. Once I get there to where that stuff is, and it becomes second nature then (as of now) my plan is to do drills where I shoot a 300 yard, a 400, yard, 500, and 600 yard target free handed. Then practice transitioning, then start going for time. Eventually I think I could get to where I could do the 4 target ladder in 20 seconds, then 15, then on and on...

    That's where I am going with my 'training'.

    After I get fairly decent at that I will have to come up with something for more shorter range targets.
    Last edited by alamo5000; 2 August 2015 at 15:44.

  3. #3
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    I'm not going to argue with any of that, but the question still stands: what are you doing to do that "training?" The trick is not to continue to do what you've been doing and get into a comfort zone. "Yep, when I shoot at at 600 yards, I still need that 20.5 MOA hold over/adjustment." It's what you're doing to improve yourself. That's the point of this thread. For example (and I'm stealing some of these ideas from others):

    - Put 3 targets at 300 yards/meters and do a 1-5 drill on them, at any shooting position. Do it on a clock. Misses count against you. Do it rounds-limited (15 rounds only). It makes sure you've got your fundamentals straight while under pressure.

    - Put a target at 100y/m with 20 individual targets that are small (2 MOA or less). Put your ammo 15-25 yards behind your gun. Run to and from your gun to collect ammo, one round at a time, and shoot at the targets. Each miss counts against you. Again, it tests how quickly you can get into your natural POA and apply your fundamentals under stress (with your heart and lungs screaming at you).

    Alamo, I know your focus right now is distance, so that's why I mentioned the above drills. But whatever your discipline you're practicing, the point is to push yourself. At the end of the day yesterday I was pretty smoked, but I finished trying to put 30 rounds on a 2/3 IPSC target from 40-50-ish yards with my G19. The whole point was to make sure I had proper sight and trigger discipline. Other than tossing my stock Glock sights in the trash, I know I need to continue to work on both. I know I missed a lot, but again, it was trying to work on specific weaknesses.

  4. #4
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    We do what we call the Suicidal Luminosity drill. This could be called something else somewhere else but it is what we call it. Basically you need a spot that is 50 yards wide and about 110 yards deep. We have two 5 count 10" pistol racks set in the center to each side there are 2 full size IPSC steel targets (each has a different colored bulls eye paint circle on it: red, blue, green, yellow). At the two corners we have 2 12" circle steel targets that are turned in at a 45 degree angle. At each 10 yard increment is a small 4' tall stake with a index card on it. Your range buddy makes your index card on it and it basically is either 1 or more of the 4 colored full size IPSC and 1 or both of the corner targets. Basically you are doing suicide sprints, start point we will refer to as zero and it is 10 yards from the line of targets, sprint out to the 10 yard line read the card engage your color targets and corner targets at that are on your index card at that marker, sprint back to zero transition to pistol shoot 1 plate. Back out to the 20 yrd line engage targets that are written down on that marker, back to zero transition to pistol shoot 1 of the plates. Rinse and repeat till you have gone all the way out to the 100 and back. This is a good cardio workout and mental workout because you have to ID the specific targets on the card and shoot them in order of what is on the card at each marker. Put it on a timer 1 sec penalty for misses on the corner targets, 2 sec penalty for the colored targets, and 1 sec penalty on the pistol plates.

    I am usually grabbing a knee at the 60-80 yard markers and going prone for the 90 & 100. Would like to scale down the IPSC targets to 2/3 to make it more difficult.

    All of our local 2 gun courses are pretty cardio intensive. All 5 stages are ran in a single run so usually at the end you are gassed out and we have a lot of shoot/no-shoot scenarios in them. I like working a lot of mental drills into my practice sessions because its not just about round counts but more about rounds on the correct threat targets.
    Last edited by Computalotapus; 3 August 2015 at 06:36.

  5. #5
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    That sounds painful!

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by gatordev View Post
    That sounds painful!

    It is and I won't lie...I have puked a couple times doing it.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Computalotapus View Post
    We do what we call the Suicidal Luminosity drill. This could be called something else somewhere else but it is what we call it. Basically you need a spot that is 50 yards wide and about 110 yards deep. We have two 5 count 10" pistol racks set in the center to each side there are 2 full size IPSC steel targets (each has a different colored bulls eye paint circle on it: red, blue, green, yellow). At the two corners we have 2 12" circle steel targets that are turned in at a 45 degree angle. At each 10 yard increment is a small 4' tall stake with a index card on it. Your range buddy makes your index card on it and it basically is either 1 or more of the 4 colored full size IPSC and 1 or both of the corner targets. Basically you are doing suicide sprints, start point we will refer to as zero and it is 10 yards from the line of targets, sprint out to the 10 yard line read the card engage your color targets and corner targets at that are on your index card at that marker, sprint back to zero transition to pistol shoot 1 plate. Back out to the 20 yrd line engage targets that are written down on that marker, back to zero transition to pistol shoot 1 of the plates. Rinse and repeat till you have gone all the way out to the 100 and back. This is a good cardio workout and mental workout because you have to ID the specific targets on the card and shoot them in order of what is on the card at each marker. Put it on a timer 1 sec penalty for misses on the corner targets, 2 sec penalty for the colored targets, and 1 sec penalty on the pistol plates.

    I am usually grabbing a knee at the 60-80 yard markers and going prone for the 90 & 100. Would like to scale down the IPSC targets to 2/3 to make it more difficult.

    All of our local 2 gun courses are pretty cardio intensive. All 5 stages are ran in a single run so usually at the end you are gassed out and we have a lot of shoot/no-shoot scenarios in them. I like working a lot of mental drills into my practice sessions because its not just about round counts but more about rounds on the correct threat targets.
    Sounds like something a drill I've done for quals (non-PD) for training.

  8. #8
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    These sound like some fun drills! I was trained by my Dad so it's all based on ambush reaction. The main one we run is to walk in a patrol stance parallel to a back-stop, about 20-30 meters away from it. At random "Contact Left/Right" is called and you're supposed to point-shoot and move in aggressively on a series of targets as fast as you can, slicing the pie in a low crouch. The targets are on boards close together and you're rated on how many shots you land and if there are any hits on the targets either side of the one you should have lined up on. Speed and aggression are what are stressed. "Push in, Push in, Push in" is the common refrain. After one magazine is expended you are to reload and then break contact by moving away from the back-stop/targets firing as you move backwards. I was taught sights are to be ignored and to only focus on looking down the side of the barrel at the target to aim. Reading this thread give me some good ideas for more fun.
    Sturgill Simpson - You can have the Crown https://youtu.be/tNV16tz1NK0

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