Let talk 1x4 and similiar scopes

[mustangfreek]

Planning ahead for my next build or another upper build and want to put a 1x4 or similiar on it. I already have a somewhat precision AR on it with a bigger scope and another with a pro.

Now i am willing to spend more then my cheap pockets want to , to get something of quality just might take me longer to save up..

Went in to cabelas today, ( only gun shop where i live that actually has a decent selection of scopes to look at) Now of course they only had 1 in stock out of a few i wanted to look at. the Burris Tac 30 was only in stock and had to find a battery to turn it on, glass looks allright, and with illumination on it wasnt bad, but again no other 1x4's in stock.

Also want to look at/thru a burris Mtac, bushnell AR 1x4, Vortex 1x4 PST, Vortex 1x4 Crossfire.

What does everyone like, use and pro's and con's of them, as i know a few of you have/had or run most of these. Although the vortex crossfire 1x4-v/brite is new and the cheapest so not sure who has one yet.

[Computalotapus]

I have only looked through the Vortex 1-4x24 PST.

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[UWone77]

You need to kind of narrow it down by what your budget is.

Basically, 1-4x24 optics are limited as far as eye relief compared to red dots. They work well for close to mid-range work, but they aren't perfect. My best advise to you is try to look through as many as you can in your price range and see which reticle you like the best and work from there. If you're lucky, maybe you can find a buddy with some of the optics you're interested in and you can shoot before you buy.

For the entry level, I do like the Vortex Viper PST 1-4 and the Burris MTAC.

SWFA right now has a deal for a Burris XTC, fastfire and mounts for $599.

[mustangfreek]

You need to kind of narrow it down by what your budget is.

Basically, 1-4x24 optics are limited as far as eye relief compared to red dots. They work well for close to mid-range work, but they aren't perfect. My best advise to you is try to look through as many as you can in your price range and see which reticle you like the best and work from there. If you're lucky, maybe you can find a buddy with some of the optics you're interested in and you can shoot before you buy.

For the entry level, I do like the Vortex Viper PST 1-4 and the Burris MTAC.

SWFA right now has a deal for a Burris XTC, fastfire and mounts for $599.

I knew you would poke in here, not interested in the fast fire/mtac combo.

Just a decent 1x4 , i know they range from 200 and up, and the tac 30 is just under 300 and mtac is another 80'ish and the vortex is 450 ish.

Have or do you run any of the tac 30 burris scopes?

Not real sure i need the illumination, but its a added benefit i guess, how are they shooting in the daylight, sunny days? useless?

[UWone77]

What's your max budget?

[mustangfreek]

What's your max budget?

Like i said im willing to spend more then my cheap ass wants too, to get a decent quality scope, also a good mount is gonna cost 100-150 either a Bobro or AD Mount, Which i have one and like it ..

Also dont have any friends that have any of these scopes, they all laugh and say all they need are ncstar and such on theres..lol, and no stores around here besides cabelas carries most models and there all out of stock.

In the end a tac 30 or mtac with a ad mount is gonna run 4-500'ish and a vortex about $600, thats new prices.

just dont know if i need that but i am growing on this buy once cry once theory..now i cant go all out like others and go nightforce, but for what im after i dont need that.

Any vortex 1x4's in the drawing ???..lol

[FortTom]

I had a Burris MTAC, 1X4X24, that went to the range about 2 or 3X. When lit, the "Ballistic CQ" reticle covered so much of the target's center, when sighting in, that, for me, it was worthless, past 25 yards. Sold or traded, can't remember, it shortly after that. Limited eye relief, and "tunnel vision" F.O.V. made it a no go. Hitting large human shaped targets, it would probably be fine, if you're not looking for small-ish groups, but I can do just as well, no, make that MUCH better with a typical red dot. The whole experience was disappointing and a waste of time and money, for me.

From what I remember, the glass was clear, but again, you have to remember, that small front lens is not going to let a lot of light in, when the sun starts going down.

On the other hand, I can't see what you see, when you look down the tube, so who knows, you may love it. But I'd definitely try to find someone else's to try, or see if they have a return policy, before I purchased one.

FT

[mustangfreek]

i hear ya FT, i know its different for everyone, and like i said i know no one clsoe with these scopes and cabelas only has the TAC 30 to look at/thru right now..

[FortTom]

i hear ya FT, i know its different for everyone, and like i said i know no one clsoe with these scopes and cabelas only has the TAC 30 to look at/thru right now..

When those (MTAC) first came out, they were selling so fast that it was hard as heck to get one, and I remember I had to pay full retail. Apparently someone liked them. Maybe you can find a good deal on a lightly used one? They've been out for a while now, so I'd bet you could pick one up cheap enough, that if you didn't like it, you could re-sell it and get most of your money back.

FT

[UWone77]

Like i said im willing to spend more then my cheap ass wants too, to get a decent quality scope, also a good mount is gonna cost 100-150 either a Bobro or AD Mount, Which i have one and like it ..

Also dont have any friends that have any of these scopes, they all laugh and say all they need are ncstar and such on theres..lol, and no stores around here besides cabelas carries most models and there all out of stock.

In the end a tac 30 or mtac with a ad mount is gonna run 4-500'ish and a vortex about $600, thats new prices.

just dont know if i need that but i am growing on this buy once cry once theory..now i cant go all out like others and go nightforce, but for what im after i dont need that.

Any vortex 1x4's in the drawing ???..lol

I think you're a little low on the prices.

You should probably stick with NCStar... probably more your speed.

I kid....

I'd start looking at reticles, that's really where you're going to either like your scope or not. As much as I like 1-4's (they are not 1x4 BTW) they are not very fast 100 yards and in. I'm guessing that's where you're doing 90% of your shooting. Something to think about.

[mustangfreek]

Lol...NCstar's rule..hehe

But really New Tac 30's are $270, Mtac is another hundred so $370 plus a ADM or similiar mount 4-500, the vortex pst wil lbe in the 600 dollar range, but willing to get it, if i like the glass better, plus vortex has a very good warranty, not sure on burris and their warranty/customer service.

Past a 100 is what i want it for, something like 100 to 3/350 yards, any farther and the bigger scoped gun comes out and any shorter the PRO will be fine, but is capable of longer then a 100.

Another reason is... i want one...

Out of the 1-4's you use UW, which are what ones? Do you feel is the best bang for the buck. Remember im not looking for operator grade but strength, reliability and overall fit and function will be considering factors.

Stole these pics from M4

Tac 30 Non-illuminated, 1x magnification at 50 yds.


Illuminated, 1x power at 50 yds.


Non-illuminated, 4x magnification at 50 yds


Illuminated, 4x power at 50 yds.


Looks decent outside, dont know if i really need the illumination. the mtac i jear has slightly better glass and a different on/off illum. switch and about a $100 more

The vortex 1-4 pst looks good just havent been able to look thru one in person

At 1X mag at 300 yards



Randomly found pic from internet view at 300yards at x4



IPSC target at 10 yards, 1x magnification, illumination setting 10



IPSC target at 100 yards, 1x magnification, illumination setting 10



The vortex has a nice reticle and doesnt look as cluttered when illuminated as the burris models/

[GOST]

I like the Vortex recticle.

[Ast]

I have the Vortex PST 1-4. I view the 1-4's as a compromise optic--they're not as quick up close a true RDS and there not as good at distance as a scope with higher magnification. That being said, I do like the scope. I like the reticle and the fact the center dot is a 1 MOA dot allowing precise placement. The illumination on the PST 1-4 is decent, but it won't really stand out on bright sunny days. The rifle wearing the PST 1-4 previously had an Eotech and magnifier. The Vortex is lighter and in my opinion more usable than the Eotech and magnifier. The eye box and eye relief on the scope is world's better than the Eotech magnifier. I've played with the Burris scopes you mentioned. I feel the quality and glass in the Vortex make it very hard to beat for the money. Vortex also has an excellent reputation for customer service.

[mustangfreek]

Thanks for the input ASt, i am feeling the voretx reticle more so then the burris also at this point, but that is just looking at them on the net, havent handled one in person yet.

I do like the smaller center dot on the vortex for sure, compared to what seems like much bigger dot on the tac 30/mtac models.